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Triggered by Beethoven: the Cultural Politics of Racial Resentment
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2020 was meant to be a year of celebration for Beethoven who was baptized 250 years ago (his exact date of birth is unknown) in Bonn on December 17, 1770. COVID-19 prompted the cancelation of commemorative concerts of Beethoven’s music, but the pandemic didn’t quell efforts by anti-White activists to attack the composer’s reputation and dominant place in the cultural pantheon of the West. Rather than a year full of performances of the great composer’s sonatas, string quartets, concertos and symphonies, 2020 saw repeated attacks on Beethoven for the crime of being a White male genius and for embodying the European musical tradition.

Beethoven is the most-performed composer in the repertoire, and his anniversary year was planned to be no exception. Before the widespread cancellation of concerts, 15 to 20 per cent of the repertoire programmed by leading orchestras was music by Beethoven. Widely regarded as the greatest composer of all time, Beethoven is inescapable because he remade almost every genre of concert music that matters. The concerto and symphony in his hands became driving musical narratives of heroic struggle. His late string quartets open a profound window on to the soul. Unlike his predecessors who were craftsmen who supplied a commodity to a paymaster, Beethoven ushered in the age of Romanticism by insisting on his creative independence and the absolute importance of self-expression: “What is in my heart must come out so I write it down.” This was manifested in his refusal to take a secure, salaried position like his one-time tutor Joseph Haydn who was the master of music for a feudal landowner in what is now Hungary.

Beethoven’s heroism in overcoming the worst thing that can happen to a composer — worsening deafness from young adulthood — to compose some of the greatest music ever has awed generations and become emblematic of triumph over adversity. All the stories of Beethoven’s misanthropy, his eccentricity and wildness, date from the decline in his hearing, which often caused him acute physical pain. Only his art prevented him from taking his own life: “It seemed to me impossible to leave the world until I had brought forth all that I felt was within me.” While Beethoven’s confidence as a pianist and conductor gradually diminished with his creeping deafness, his imaginative powers as a composer grew stronger and stronger, and he cast a daunting shadow over his successors: Brahms did not feel confident tackling a symphony until he was in his forties.

Beethoven excelled at his trade because he was born with a gift and worked at it as hard as it is possible to work. Swafford notes how his sketches and manuscripts reveal that:

Nothing came easily to him, least of all composing. Where Mozart could dream up a whole piece in his head while playing billiards, Beethoven had to worry and whip every note into place in his sketches. The sketchbooks are amazing documents: gold being refined from raw ore, pedestrian ideas becoming revolutionary concepts, incoherence being forged into clarity and purposefulness. Even the final manuscripts are a morass of scrawls and blots and revisions on top of revisions.[1]Jan Swafford, The Vintage Guide to Classical Music: An Indispensable Guide for Understanding and Enjoying Classical Music (Knopf, 1993), 184-85.

Beethoven’s Faustian spirit made him into the kind of figure that dominated the imagination of nineteenth century Europeans: the superhuman genius, the revolutionary hero, the master of his own fate and transformer of the world. This reputation carried over into the twentieth century with the influential French writer Romain Rolland holding the composer up as a role model for a less heroic age, epitomizing personal sincerity and self-denial — in a word, authenticity.[2]Romain Rolland, Beethoven the Creator (Rolland Press, 2008)

Attacks on Beethoven

Laudatory references to White male geniuses like Beethoven inevitably trigger rage from anti-White commentators who huff that it has “long been an argument of white supremacists, Nazis, Neo-Nazis, and racial separatists that ‘classical music,’ the music of ‘white people,’ is inherently more sophisticated, complicated, and valuable than the musical traditions of Africa, Asia, South America, or the Middle East, thus proving the innate superiority of the ‘white race.’” Seen through the Cultural Marxist lens of critical race and gender theory, Beethoven’s music dominates the concert repertoire not because of its exceptional quality, but because White-male privilege and assumptions about White-male genius keep it there. Linda Shaver-Gleason insisted Beethoven’s dominant place in the canon was the result of a White supremacist conspiracy which “intentionally suppressed” the music of non-White composers “in the service of a narrative of white — specifically German — cultural supremacy (because, alas, that too is part of Western culture).”

Slate online recently rebuked Beethoven for his mononym: the fact he is known by a single name, like Michelangelo or Shakespeare. This practice supposedly gives the pedestal of nomenclature to “straight white men at the expense of everyone else.” White male composers, it is claimed, “became so ensconced in elite musical society’s collective consciousness that only one word was need to evoke their awesome specter. Mouthfuls of full names became truncated to terse sets of universally recognized syllables: Mozart. Beethoven. Bach.” The works of composers with mononyms are therefore assumed to be “on a different plane,” whereas this assumption is, we are told, actually the product of “centuries of systematic prejudice, exclusion, sexism and racism.”

In a recent Vox podcast and article, musicologist Nate Sloan and songwriter Charlie Harding claim the opening bars of Beethoven’s Fifth Symphony (the famous da-da-da-DUM motif) should not be given their traditional interpretation — the sound of fate knocking on the door and Beethoven’s resilience in the face of encroaching deafness — but should be construed as the sound of the gate slamming shut on minorities, such as “women, LGBTQ+ people, people of color.” They assert (without evidence) that “wealthy white men” embraced the Fifth Symphony as a “symbol of their superiority and importance.” Black clarinetist Anthony McGill agrees, likening the inescapability of the Fifth Symphony to a “wall” between classical music and new, racially-diverse audiences.

Jewish music writer Norman Lebrecht defended Beethoven against Sloan and Harding’s polemic by citing Beethoven’s “liberal” credentials, claiming, for example, that they “fail to explore how Beethoven’s Fifth served for millions as a symbol of freedom in the war against Nazism.” Unmentioned by Lebrecht is the fact that, despite Beethoven’s politics — which were liberal for their time (he had republican sympathies) — the composer made repeated comments critical of Lebrecht’s own ethnic group. On one occasion, he rejected the idea of selling his Missa Solemnis to the Jewish music publisher Adolf Schlesinger in favor of the German publisher C.F. Peters, informing the latter that: “In no circumstances will Schlesinger ever get anything more from me, because he too has played me a Jewish trick.” Beethoven’s disgust with Schlesinger was prompted by repeated experiences of being short-changed with “such insulting niggardliness, the like of which I have never experienced.”[3]Jan Swafford, Beethoven: Anguish and Triumph (Faber, 2015), 760. In a letter of 1823, Beethoven called Schlesinger “a beach peddler and rag-and-bone Jew.” In his negotiations with another publisher, Beethoven noted the publisher was “neither Jew nor Italian” and that as he himself was also neither of these, “perhaps we shall come to some agreement.”[4]Lewis Lockwood, Beethoven: The music and the Life (Norton, 2005), 533.

Sloan and Harding are on stronger ground in arguing the thematic complexity of the Fifth Symphony necessitated unprecedentedly close listening to fully grasp, and this, in turn, led to the establishment of new norms of concert behavior. These norms — sitting still, staying quiet and not clapping mid-piece — led to the strict culture of classical music that persists to this day, and which allegedly oppresses non-Whites who cannot reasonably be expected to conform to such standards of behavior. Sloan and Harding lament that classical concerts are the sole remaining American institution that typically insists on starting on time. Rather than a sign of respect for all parties involved, these behavioral and procedural norms are, they insist, symbols of White supremacy which alienate “diverse audiences,” and their origins can be traced to Beethoven.

Jewish music writer for The New Yorker, Alex Ross, labelled the planned 2020 Beethoven celebrations “a gratuitously excessive celebration of the two-hundred-and-fiftieth birthday of a composer who hardly needs any extra publicity.” He insists that, in the wake of the Black Lives Matter riots, an examination of the relationship between classical music, which he labels “blindingly white, both in its history and present,” and racism is “sorely needed” because of the genre’s “extreme dependence on a problematic past.” Ross claims that when the classical music tradition was transplanted to the United States, the “white majority tended to adopt European music as a badge of its supremacy. The classical-music institutions that emerged in the mid- and late nineteenth century — the New York Philharmonic, the Boston Symphony, the Metropolitan Opera, and the like — became temples to European gods. … Little effort was made to cultivate American composers; it seemed more important to manufacture a fantasy of Beethovenian grandeur.”

For Ross, classical music can only “overcome the shadows of its past” if it commits itself to a “much more radical confrontation with the white European inheritance,” and by programing more non-White composers like Julius Eastman — a Black composer whose “improvisatory structures, his subversive political themes, and his openness about his homosexuality give him a revolutionary aspect, yet he also had a nostalgic flair for the grand romantic manner.’”

In the frontline of attacks on Beethoven in 2020 was Black music writer and Hunter College academic Philip Ewell, who penned an article titled “Beethoven was an Above-Average Composer — Let’s Leave it at That.” Ewell begrudges the laudatory epithets routinely applied to White composers like Beethoven and their works. For Ewell, adjectives like “genius” and “masterwork,” evoke slavery (master-slave) and sexism (master-mistress), and the classical music lexicon is, in his assessment, overflowing with euphemisms that disguise and reinforce the “white-male frame.”

In addition to “master’ and its derivatives, here are some of the other common euphemisms for white and whiteness in music theory’s white racial frame: authentic, canonic, civilized, classic(s), conventional, core (“core” requirement), European, function (“functional” tonality), fundamental, genius, German (“German” language requirement), great (“great” works), maestro, opus (magnum “opus”), piano (“piano” proficiency, skills), seminal, sophisticated, titan(ic), towering, traditional, and western. Even terms such as “the long nineteenth century” and “fin de siècle” can be considered euphemisms for whiteness and white framing for their close associations with dates and events (and languages) significant to Europe and Europeanism. Such euphemisms are intended to sublimate whiteness into less objectionable forms, thus mitigating the effect of whiteness on music theory and hiding its existence.

Rather than enjoying a merited reputation for the brilliance and originality of his oeuvre, Ewell insists Beethoven’s fame has been upheld by such lexical scaffolding, claiming Beethoven, “along with countless other white males, has been propped up by the white-male frame, both consciously and subconsciously, with descriptors such as genius, master and masterwork.” In Ewell’s jaundiced assessment, Beethoven’s Ninth Symphony is “no more a masterpiece” than Esperanza Spalding’s 12 Little Spells (click the links and judge for yourself). The status of Beethoven’s Ninth is purely, he argues, a product of music theory’s “white-male frame” which “obfuscates race and gender.”

Ewell’s attack on Beethoven is an adjunct of this broader hostility to classical music’s “white racial frame” which, he insists, reinforces the hierarchy of White male composers, and “works in concert with patriarchal structures to advantage whiteness and maleness while disadvantaging POC and non-males.” This frame purportedly encompasses Western tonality itself (with its major-minor harmony and its equal-tempered scale) which is assumed to be the “master” language. Ewell even regards the Gregorian calendar as “white racial framing writ large,” insisting “no one can deny the racial element behind how the world now understands the linear and cyclic nature of time.”

Phillip Ewell
Phillip Ewell

In an article for the journal Music Theory Online entitled “Music Theory and the White Racial Frame,” Ewell argues that “music theory is white [it is]” and the discipline is undergirded by a deep-seated ideology of White supremacy calculated to thwart Black and Brown (but strangely not East Asian) achievement in classical music. The main target of Ewell’s critique is the early twentieth-century music theorist Heinrich Schenker (1868–1935) who initiated the parsing of musical structures into foreground, middle-ground and background to tease out the tonal formulas that underpin large-scale movements. Drawing on poststructuralist critiques of Western civilization, Ewell claims this kind of score-driven analysis of musical works as part of Western musicology (what he dubs the “drive to scientificize music analysis”) represents an effort to “shore up whiteness in music theory’s white frame” and to insulate “whiteness from potential criticism.” In attacking Schenker (who was an Austrian Jew), Ewell inadvertently strayed into forbidden fields of inquiry and faced unexpectedly fierce blowback and accusations of “Black anti-Semitism.”

Ewell’s “white racial frame” purportedly extends to musical education where, in the most commonly used theory textbooks in the United States, only 1.63% of musical examples come from non-White composers. This is also problematic for Linda Shaver-Gleason because studying a particular piece “reaffirms its canonical status; enshrining it in a textbook is deeming it worthy of study.” Constantly referencing White composers “reinforces the idea that they’re the ones who deserve the most respect, as if to say, ‘Marvel at the many techniques Mozart used so perfectly!’” Ethan Hein, a (presumably Jewish) doctoral fellow in music education at NYU, likewise decries the stubbornness of music teachers in teaching “European-descended” classical music over that of “music descending from the vernacular traditions of the African diaspora.” Orienting music education towards the European classical tradition, an “implicit racial ideology,” is, he declares, “insidious” in its “affirmations of Whiteness.”

In 2020, college-level music pedagogy responded to Black Lives Matter by “dramatically reconsidering which composers and musical traditions we do and don’t discuss in the classroom.” Similar dynamics were at work within other musical institutions. The Metropolitan Opera, upon cancelling its 2020–21 season, announced that it would begin its next season with Black composer Terence Blanchard’s Fire Shut Up in My Bones, the first opera by a Black composer to appear on the Met’s stage. Despite such gestures, for Slate journalist Chris White, musicians, academics, and teachers still “have a lot of work ahead to confront the racist and sexist history of classical music.”

Music theory’s white racial frame is also sustained, according to Ewell, by the “citational chain” of white men citing other white men in the musicological literature. He wants to break this chain “in which whiteness begets whiteness and maleness begets maleness.” Meanwhile, Ewell’s own utterly conventional and establishment beliefs are the unreflective product of his engagement with a group of predominantly Jewish critical race and gender theorists: he borrowed the term “white racial frame” from Harvard sociology professor Joe Feagin. Arguing that the entire Western art music tradition is inherently White supremacist, Ewell advocates “overthrowing the existing structure and building a new one that would accommodate non-white music a priori [prior to listening to it??] no reaching for ‘inclusion’ necessary because non-white composers would already be there.”

Beethoven and the “New Musicology”

Ewell postures as an outsider bravely challenging sinister norms entrenched in Western musicology when, in reality, his perspective has been utterly conventional since the advent of the “New Musicology” in late 1980s — when Cultural Marxists to a significant extent overran the discipline. Musicology was one of the last frontiers for poststructuralism and critical theory which had already infested most of the humanities and social sciences by the early 1980s. The New Musicology was founded by the Jewish-American critic and musicologist Joseph Kerman (born Zukerman) whose journalist father William Zukerman (1885–1961) was a prominent figure in the Jewish media and author of the 1937 book The Jew in Revolt: The Modern Jew in the World Crisis.

A key figure in the ascent of the “New Musicology” was Susan McClary whose 1991 book Feminine Endings: Music, Gender and Sexuality is considered a trailblazing text for the movement. McClary gained fame and notoriety for her feminist “analysis” of the first movement of Beethoven’s Ninth Symphony, where she claimed: “The point of recapitulation in the first movement of the Ninth is one of the most horrifying in music, as the carefully prepared cadence is frustrated, damming up energy which finally explodes in the throttling murderous rage of a rapist incapable of attaining release.” This risible statement was an elaboration of her belief the Western musical convention of sonata form is inherently sexist, misogynistic and imperialistic: that “tonality itself — with its process of instilling expectations and subsequently withholding promised fulfilment until climax — is the principle musical means during the period from 1600 to 1900 for arousing and channeling desire.” The primary “masculine” key (or first subject group) is said to represent the male self, and the secondary “feminine” key (or second subject group) represents the “other,” a territory to be explored and conquered, assimilated into the self and stated in the tonic home key.

Virtually all Cultural Marxist critiques of Western classical music fall back on these kind of entirely speculative metaphors. While purporting to offer additional insight into music, the New Musicology systematically imposes an anti-White male ideology on its subject, and, in this endeavor, happily discards all standards of proof and evidence. The conceit that, before the advent of the New Musicology, the discipline was limited to the rigid boundaries of empiricism and positivism is false; awareness of the context and reception of music has always been a core topic of musicology. There was, however, also a belief in purely musical elements and in the value of studying them. The problem with such “objective” technical analysis, for the likes of McClary and Ewell, is that it invariably leads to “White supremacist” conclusions about the relative quality of different musical traditions. The “problematic dimension” of analyzing “music as simply music,” McClary notes, is that people inevitably point to Western classical music “as evidence of the superiority of European and European-descended people, which marginalizes the rest of the world and, also, minority groups in the U.S.”

Constructing Beethoven as Black

The main alternative to the Cultural Marxist deconstruction (and proposed anti-White reconstruction) of the Western musical canon, has been attempts by Blacks to appropriate Beethoven for themselves. Given Beethoven’s status as the archetypical musical genius, it is unsurprising that aggrieved Blacks have, since the early twentieth century, attempted to propagate the myth that Beethoven had some African ancestry. The basis for this entirely spurious claim was the composer’s slightly swarthy complexion, and the fact part of his family traced its roots to Flanders, which was, for a period, under Spanish monarchical rule. Because Spain had a longstanding historical connection to North Africa through the Moors, a degree of blackness supposedly trickled down to the great composer — this despite the fact the Moors as an ethnic group weren’t even Black.

The myth was eagerly disseminated by Jamaican “historian” Joel Augustus Rogers (1880–1966) in works like Sex and Race (1941—44), the two-volume World’s Great Men of Color (1946–47), 100 Amazing Facts About the Negro (1934), Five Negro Presidents (1965), and Nature Knows No Color Line (1952). Rogers, whose intellectual rigor was basically non-existent, claimed that Beethoven — in addition to Thomas Jefferson, Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, Robert Browning, and several popes, among others — was genealogically African and thus Black. Despite being thoroughly debunked, the myth still lingers in contemporary culture: in 2007 Nadine Gordimer published a short story collection called Beethoven Was One-Sixteenth Black: And Other Stories. The determination, contrary to all available evidence, to make Beethoven Black is, of course, a desperate attempt to make the composer and his oeuvre a glorious symbol of Black accomplishment.

A pearl of wisdom from Jamaican historian Joel Augustus Rogers (1880–1966)
A pearl of wisdom from Jamaican historian Joel Augustus Rogers (1880–1966)

Otherwise sympathetic commentators have cautioned that such efforts are self-defeating, merely serving to treat the Western canon as fundamental and all other styles as deviations from this norm, thus reinforcing “the notion that of classical music as a universal standard and something that everyone should aspire to appreciate.” Trying to make Beethoven Black and desperately scouring the historical records for examples of non-Whites who wrote symphonies is to accept “a white-centric perspective that presents symphonies as the ultimate human achievement in the arts.”

Among those routinely cited by those desperate to prove the racial diversity of the Western art music tradition are the mixed-race composers Chevalier de Saint George, Samuel Coleridge-Taylor and George Bridgetower. These figures are remembered solely because they were non-White, not because of the excellence of their compositions. Beethoven personally knew Bridgetower, a talented violinist whose father was from the West Indies. Indeed, Bridgetower was the original dedicatee of one of Beethoven’s most celebrated violin sonatas. Beethoven called it the “mulatto sonata” after Bridgetower (before the word took on a more pejorative sense) and the pair gave the first performance but fell out soon afterwards, whereupon Beethoven renamed the piece for another violinist, Rudolphe Kreutzer.

Conclusion

Classical music, like other aspects of Western culture, has been a casualty of the anti-White diversity mania that now infests Western intellectual life. The Cultural Marxist critique of classical music (and of Beethoven) wallows in bad faith arguments and cognitive dissonance: Western classical music is nothing exceptional, yet cannot be invoked to praise White people because this necessarily implies the inferiority of other races; a White supremacist conspiracy thwarts Black and Brown achievement in the genre, but utterly fails to prevent East Asian interest and success; Black composers have written symphonies (and, indeed, Beethoven himself was Black), yet the Western classical music tradition is inherently White supremacist and needs radical deconstruction.

Ultimately, the reason the classical music canon (and Beethoven’s status as a titan of European civilization) is so keenly resented by anti-White activists, is because the gap in civilizational attainment it underscores is an embarrassing affront to regnant egalitarian assumptions. Western art music (with Beethoven as its leading exponent) stands as a glaring testament to the pre-eminence of European high culture, and implicitly of the race responsible for it. The attacks on Beethoven in 2020 are yet another example of warfare waged against White people through the construction of culture.

Brenton Sanderson is the author of Battle Lines: Essays on Western Culture, Jewish Influence and Anti-Semitism , available here and here.

Notes

[1] Jan Swafford, The Vintage Guide to Classical Music: An Indispensable Guide for Understanding and Enjoying Classical Music (Knopf, 1993), 184-85.

[2] Romain Rolland, Beethoven the Creator (Rolland Press, 2008)

[3] Jan Swafford, Beethoven: Anguish and Triumph (Faber, 2015), 760.

[4] Lewis Lockwood, Beethoven: The music and the Life (Norton, 2005), 533.

(Republished from The Occidental Observer by permission of author or representative)
 
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  1. raga10 says:

    Slate online recently rebuked Beethoven for his mononym: the fact he is known by a single name, like Michelangelo or Shakespeare. This practice supposedly gives the pedestal of nomenclature to “straight white men at the expense of everyone else.”

    I will start referring to Beethoven as “Ludvig van Beethoven” when they start referring to Beyonce as “Beyonce Knowles-Carter”.

  2. This astonished me. I wonder what Paul Robeson would have said about this weird subversion of music. Or Marian Anderson, or Duke Ellington, Ella Fitzgerald and Louis Armstrong.

    • Agree: GomezAdddams, 36 ulster
    • Replies: @Fluesterwitz
    , @Barzini
  3. I am so sick of hearing about racism. Such total BS. Blacks are victims of their own dysfunctional ideology, nothing else!

    • Disagree: TheTrumanShow
  4. martin_2 says:

    Non-whites are humiliated by the obvious superiority of the West when it comes, not just to music, but also art, literature and even architecture. To say nothing of the West’s unrivalled philosophical traditions, and its science and technology. The fact they write drivel about Beethoven being black or not being any good is just a manifestation of that and nothing more needs to be said.

    • Agree: Pop Warner
    • Replies: @phillip sawicki
  5. Schuetze says:

    Jews use blacks as bullets against whites. Beethoven has clearly been declared “Amalek” by the racial supremacist Rabbi’s.

    Since there are so few statues of Beethoven for blacks to stage BLM chimpouts in front of, the shabbez Black bullets are chimping out on the pages of their their affirmative action media slave owner plantations. Nothing to new to see here at all.

    It is only a matter of time until they come after the Boomer musical idols. They have already started their war against country music, but it will soon move beyond Elvis and hit at the heart of white Rock and Roll. Beatles are black anyway. Of course after the Beach Boys are transformed into a beach jive band, Surfing will be declared an african invention to escape from evil white slave ships. When Jagger and Richards finally croak, they too will either be proven to have black ancestors or they will be flushed down the talmudic memory hole.

    • Replies: @omegabooks
    , @36 ulster
  6. Rahan says:

    Joseph Stalin addressing the Red Army on Feb 23rd, 1942

    Красная Армия имеет своей целью изгнать немецких оккупантов из нашей страны и освободить Советскую землю от немецко-фашистских захватчиков. Очень вероятно, что война за освобождение Советской земли приведет к изгнанию или уничтожению клики Гитлера. Мы приветствовали бы подобный исход. Но было бы смешно отождествлять клику Гитлера с германским народом, с германским государством. Опыт истории говорит, что гитлеры приходят и уходят, а народ германский, а государство германское остается.

    https://petroleks.ru/stalin/15-64.php
    It would be laughable to equate Hitler’s clique with the German nation, the German state. History tells us that Hitlers come and go, but the German nation, the German state endures.

    Soviet speech about Beethoven:

    Все последующее европейское музыкальное искусство вплоть до наших дней диалектически развилось из начал, заложенных в бетховенской музыке. Только с Октябрем, только в нашей стране, широкие массы трудящихся явились, наконец, теми желанными слушателями, для которых выдвинутые Бетховеном высокие идеалы героизма, воли, борьбы, творческого энтузиазма, социальной правды и братской солидарности стали делом жизни, стали повседневной действительностью

    https://document.wikireading.ru/55500
    According to the speaker only in Soviet Russia did the ideal listener of Beethoven finally appear, worthy of the music’s heights.

    Yeah. That moment when you realize Stalin was saner than the modern US left about alleged racial or national guilt, and that the Soviet Union as such strove, in theory at least, to create a society worthy of the vision of the classics, as opposed to creating a society so primitive and dim and the classics would be poison to it.

    This brings me back to my old theory that when Stalin purged the degenerates and either had them shot, or reeducated, or exiled, in the West it’s the degenerate wing that became dominant and burrowed into the social fabric, slowly dissolving healthy tissue. And now here we are.

    • Troll: Schuetze
    • Replies: @Verymuchalive
  7. “no one can deny the racial element behind how the world now understands the linear and cyclic nature of time.”

    I’ll have what he’s smoking.

    • Replies: @Fluesterwitz
  8. Yikes, talk about overcompensating for an inferiority complex, which in the case of these absurdist critics, is probably all too well grounded in fact. They’re borrowing the anxious narrow-mindedness of conservatism, which sees everything as a zero sum game in which no one can have enough if anything is shared. And they are as smug and humorless as Puritans: maybe they should listen to “Roll Over, Beethoven” a few hundred times and calm the hell down already. Plenty of us love Delta blues as much as classical sonatas, and don’t care one way or the other about the skin pigment or genitals of the composer.

    • Thanks: Grahamsno(G64)
  9. Wyatt says:

    it has “long been an argument of white supremacists, Nazis, Neo-Nazis, and racial separatists that ‘classical music,’ the music of ‘white people,’ is inherently more sophisticated, complicated, and valuable than the musical traditions of Africa, Asia, South America, or the Middle East

    When they do shit like this, they make the Nazis look less worse. Listening to other people’s music ranges from “it’s okay” to “get this ooga booga trash out of my headphones.”

    • Agree: Fluesterwitz
  10. @Jerry Roberts

    They would have seen it just so.
    Or, they would have suffered from some variety of ‘false consciousness’.

  11. @Cool Daddy Jimbo

    “Cyclic nature” is now apparently connoted as Western, white, and male. The things you learn.

    • Replies: @animalogic
  12. GeeBee says:

    Ultimately, the reason the classical music canon (and Beethoven’s status as a titan of European civilization) is so keenly resented by anti-White activists, is because the gap in civilizational attainment it underscores is an embarrassing affront to regnant egalitarian assumptions. Western art music (with Beethoven as its leading exponent) stands as a glaring testament to the pre-eminence of European high culture, and implicitly of the race responsible for it.

    A brave and entirely accurate summation. The war on Whites must, but of course, begin by laying waste to the enemy’s armoury and scattering his treasure. I welcome this, as only an attack on something so fundamental to ourselves as are our cultural and artistic achievements, will wake people up to what is planned for us.

    As for that Jewish tart’s remark that “The point of recapitulation in the first movement of [Beethoven’s] Ninth [symphony] is one of the most horrifying in music, as the carefully prepared cadence is frustrated, damming up energy which finally explodes in the throttling murderous rage of a rapist incapable of attaining release”, I have to say that (until she veers off into feminist garbage invoking rape, at least) she describes the climax of that remarkable movement extremely well .

    As a very young man, when I first discovered the D-minor symphony (as I prefer to refer to the ‘ninth’ as), I was shaken to my very core by this (first) movement, and especially by the recapitulation. It made the most profound emotional effect upon me, so much so that I knew I had discovered some sort of magic key into my soul. The version I heard (it was loaned to me on 33-rpm vinyl by a school chum) was of Wilhelm Furtwängler conducting the Bayreuth Festival Orchestra in 1951. A masterful performance.

    I have a very eclectic taste in music, but I am under no illusions whatever that Beethoven, along with Wagner, Mozart and Bach, were men set apart from the rest of humanity. They were, to me, conduits down which flowed musical offerings from the gods.

    Jazz is all very fine. Beethoven it ain’t.

  13. lloyd says: • Website

    Hitler in Mein Kampf compared jazz to the mimicri of monkeys and called it Jew music. He said it was imitative instead of creative. Hitler belonged to his conservative generation. My guess is he secretly enjoyed it but saw its destructive elements to traditional German culture. How could he not as a lover of Wagner and apparently of some Negroid DNA? In National Socialist Germany, jazz among the younger generation was often very popular and seen as anti establishment. It was entirely legal but not encouraged.

    • Replies: @R2b
  14. @raga10

    Speaking of elevated mononyms, try this on for size:

    Einstein, Freud, Marx.

    The Jews intend to do away with gentile demigods so they can impose on us an alternative litany of far greater ‘geniuses’ (of the Jewish persuasion.)

    Jewish supremacism is real. It is hostile, hypocritical, and unrelenting.

    • Thanks: cronkitsche
  15. Unlike his predecessors who were craftsmen who supplied a commodity to a paymaster…

    Yeah, shmucks like Handel, Vivaldi, Bach, Mozart, and Haydn. What did they ever accomplish?

    Beethoven ushered in the age of Romanticism by insisting on his creative independence and the absolute importance of self-expression

    So it’s his fault, not Ayn Rand’s. The idea that pleasing oneself through pleasing one’s audience is somehow inferior to egoism had to start somewhere.

    • Replies: @Verymuchalive
    , @R2b
  16. @GeeBee

    …Beethoven, along with Wagner, Mozart and Bach, were men set apart from the rest of humanity. They were, to me, conduits down which flowed musical offerings from the gods.

    So hard work, dedication, and good taste had nothing to do with it? They were just in the lucky sperm club?

    I’d give them more credit than that!

  17. The end result of the politically correct ‘woke” fascism will be an increase of all forms of racism, including a reaction which bolsters racism against blacks as anti-civilization barbarians in reaction to this absurd fancy.

    • Replies: @TKK
  18. anarchyst says:

    I propose that “A Whiter Shade of Pale” by Procol Harum be adopted as the white nationalist anthem.

    • Agree: Alfred
  19. Gemjunior says:
    @raga10

    Funny that you should mention her, since that’s the best they have to offer in music…

  20. @GeeBee

    ” Jazz is fine. Beethoven it ain’t”

    Bullshit, LVB is marvelous, otherworldly and immortal, however the melodic wonderworld of one Charlie Parker most certainly does rank up there with LVB’s creations, and is in no way inferior to the ideas of Bach, Mozart or any of the classical titans.

    Anyone who has an ear for true greatness in music would never make such an ignorant, crude statement such as yours.

    AJM “Mensa” qualified since 1973, airborne trained US army vet, and pro Jazz performer (winds)

    PS : myself having completed, decades ago, conservatory studies of classical flute, I do actually know what I am talking about.

  21. TTSSYF says:
    @raga10

    And I’ll start referring to him as __, or “The Artist Formerly Known as Beethoven”.

  22. @Rahan

    Produce a translation of the Russian comments, please. This is an English language website, after all. If this were a Spanish, French or Russian language website, they would not expect an English quotation to be presented without a translation.

    • Replies: @Rahan
  23. @Reg Cæsar

    Sanderson’s work is generally good, but it is obvious that he has no great grasp of classical music. Just prior to your quote, he wrote.

    Beethoven is the most-performed composer in the repertoire, and his anniversary year was planned to be no exception. Before the widespread cancellation of concerts, 15 to 20 per cent of the repertoire programmed by leading orchestras was music by Beethoven.

    There is no reference for that claim. As a frequent concertgoer, I would guess at the lower single digits.
    I stopped reading the article shortly thereafter. I’m sure his intentions are good, but the emphasis on Beethoven tends to put most classical music lovers off.

    • Replies: @La Regenta
    , @unwoke
  24. Nick J says:

    Interesting how most people in Western societies listen daily to music that bears its rhythmic origins to West African music. This arrived with slaves in the Americas, and it has conquered all cultures as jazz, rock’n roll and derivatives there of.

    One wonders how the bearers of race based criticism of art
    can utilise valuable time so frivolously, so insultingly? Who pays their upkeep allowing them time to develop such damage to everybody?

  25. @Verymuchalive

    The 15 to 20 percent claim clearly refers to programming in 2020 – not programming in general. It’s likely correct given many orchestras planned entire cycles of the symphonies to celebrate the Beethoven anniversary.

    • Replies: @Verymuchalive
  26. Rahan says:
    @Verymuchalive

    *Produce a translation of the Russian comments, please. This is an English language website, after all.*

    I get where you’re coming from, Verymuchalive,

    My policy as a poster here, concerning quotes in other languages, is that everyone has access to online translate at a moment’s notice, the process taking mere seconds. If the quoted bits in a foreign language are short, and context allows to glean what they are about, then all that’s left for anyone who really wants to know the exact wording, is to use online translate.

    Poetry, perhaps, or artistic prose, really would require human translation, because this would be a question of style as much as content. In the remaining 90% of cases, any generic online translate function, should suffice.

    It is 2020, and I believe it would be beneficial for us all to learn to use the many delightful free online tools available to us, which were not available even in the recent past. This includes also the use of anonymous “burner” email accounts and phone numbers for registration, for example, also browsers like Brave that add a veneer of privacy, indie alternatives to Skype and Zoom, and so on.

    Information-wise, it would mean exploring the social media and video sharing services of other civilizations (even say Turkish or Latino ones), and reading/watching the news of other civilizations too. English is still the lingua franca of the world, thus one only needs to take a step back from one’s boxed in thinking, in order to see the abundant choice existing. Even choosing one random international news source once a day over covfefe for twenty minutes, should be enough of a ritual to really shake loose one’s cognitive limitations over just say a fortnight.

    To get the ball rolling, one could perhaps have covfefe number one while exploring the Nigerian Sun https://www.sunnewsonline.com/ and covfefe number two over the Indonesian “Jakarta Globe” https://jakartaglobe.id/

    And, whenever someone runs into a bit in a foreign language but is curious–online translate is but a click away.

    • Replies: @dimples
    , @Alden
  27. Rahan says:
    @Authenticjazzman

    Bullshit, LVB is marvelous, otherworldly and immortal, however the melodic wonderworld of one Charlie Parker most certainly does rank up there with LVB’s creations, and is in no way inferior to the ideas of Bach, Mozart or any of the classical titans.

    Flute or not, I must disagree;)

    Aside from the evolution of Jazz into sophisticated brilliantly neurotic soundscapes, we also have subsequent developments. We have rock’n’roll evolving into formidable prog rock achievements by the late 1960s and early 1970s, then heavymetal also begins evolving not only into prog but also into symphonic venues, then death and black metal develop their own versions of sophisticated majesty, and even some of the grunge chaps, such as Tool aren’t half bad when they grow up.

    Additionally we have the electronic forms of music, wherein for example in Trance and Ambient some incredible structures and experiences may be hidden.

    Also: various rock and metal guitar virtuosos who are basically a genre of their own. Joe Satriani, Andi Timmons, Tony MacAlpine etc.

    It is a gift from the gods that all of these exist, but they are no more equal to the 19th and 18th century composer geniuses, than for example Jonathan Franzen, John Updike, Don Delillo, or Tom Pynchon, are the equals of Tolstoy, Dostoyevski, Zola, Balzac, Turgenev, or even bloody Dickens.

    When reading Anna Karenina in the correct state of mind, soon enough a sort of quasi out of body universalist experience kicks in, as if one has been plugged into a patch of the self-perceiving grid of the universe, covering the dimensions not only of human perception, but also of insects reacting to vibrations and leaves and blades of grass feeling the wind.

    Even Fitzgerald’s Gatsby, which is a complete and utter masterpiece of structure, flow, character, and prose, does not do that. It is a much smaller, focused, non-universal affair, as an experience. It’s good he did it the way he did, because this was his brilliance. His other attempts to encompass what he couldn’t were sloppy. Gatsby is the anti-sloppy eternal standard.

    If Tolstoy is Beethoven, then Fitzgerald is Charlie Parker meets Thelonius Monk, then Tom Wolfe is sympho prog. All three brilliant, no doubt, but let’s be real here.

    It’s one thing, to combine a Pythagorean mapping of the universe through sound, with ones own temperament and vision, and produce cathedrals of infinite moving parts, which all follow a mathematical plan, and every crypto-chord being produced by twenty different instruments at the same time.

    Jazz, rock, metal, and electronic music (and modern “classical” composers) can periodically hit this level for a second or a minute, but that’s it. And that’s OK. It’s wonderful that we have different types of brilliance, and I for one the older I get the more experiencing “astral levels” of brilliance drains me. These days I can listen to Tchaikovsky or Vivaldi like 2-3 times a year. Too overwhelming.

    But saying that Charlie Parker is on the same plane as Beethoven is like saying that Jimi Hendrix is on the same plane as Mozart, or that Dream Theater are on the level of Chopin, or that Zadie Smith is on the level of Flaubert.

    • Agree: R2b
    • Disagree: Badger Down
    • Thanks: Grahamsno(G64), GeeBee
    • Replies: @Authenticjazzman
  28. Historical fact:
    Abram Petrovich Gannibal was born in Cameroon, sold by the Turks as a slave to the Russians. Czar Peter freed and adopted him as godson.
    He made an astonishing career in czarist Russia (up to major-general and superintendent of Reval) was ennobled by Elizabeth of Russia and became the great-grandfather of Alexander Pushkin.

    • Replies: @Alden
  29. @Rahan

    Listen you pontificating, as far as music is concerned layperson, myself I have been on the road as a practicing pro Jazz musician for fifty-plus years, and you are trying to school me on a subject of which your knowledge and participation is nil compared to mine.

    And as I said : I completed decades ago the study of classical flute performance in conservatory going through the books of JSB, WAM, Debussy, and others. I had worked the two Mozart flute concertos, in G and D, which he penned in Mannheim, to performance level, and was acclaimed to emote a superb tonal quality flute-wise, and here you come talking down to myself as if you actually know what you are talking about, which you do not.

    AJM

    PS as an annecdotal side-note : I had resided in an apartment fifty meters from the former Pfaelzer Hof hotel in Mannheim where he, WAM, had resided anno 1777 and was the site of his creation of these two Wunderwerke.

    PPS You obviously do not comprehend Charlie Parker’s great musical ideas and Jazz itself.

  30. @La Regenta

    I take your point. For the likes of the Berlin Philharmonic or the Vienna Philharmonic, I’m sure it would be true. Less so, the further from Central Europe.

  31. rienzi says:

    I have no doubt that 500 years from now people will still be listening to, and enjoying, Beethoven and all those other old, dead, white guys.

    I am also certain that the works of their current critics will be long forgotten, if indeed, they even still exist.

    • Replies: @Rahan
  32. Rahan says:
    @rienzi

    I have no doubt that 500 years from now people will still be listening to, and enjoying, Beethoven and all those other old, dead, white guys.

    But will this be happening outside of places like Korea and Slovakia?
    (Or whatever they are called 500 years from now)

    • Agree: Rahan
    • Replies: @HeebHunter
  33. @Authenticjazzman

    If these controversies are to be resolved by each disputant’s qualifications, what would you say to one of your peers who shares Rahan’s opinions?

    • Thanks: Rahan
  34. momsaid says:

    When my children were young, the going thing was to aver that Mathematics were invented by Black Africans, that the early Egyptians were Black, and that all cultures and peoples grew from that race.

    Now we are told that telling time (or paying attention to it) is much too difficult for Blacks to grasp, and it’s a sign of Whiteness to insist on being punctual…or play classical music.

    Would the virtue signalers please decide which races they think are superior or incompetent, and stick to their story? It would make it easier for us reasonable people who just happen to have played in the orchestra with Black classmates…and did just fine!

    • Replies: @Peter D. Bredon
  35. @Authenticjazzman

    I am a jazz keys player myself. Good jazz is indeed a high form of the musical art, in our time.

    Likewise, Beethoven was seeking high art, and attempting to make a living doing it, in his time. Wynton Marsalis is a Beethoven fan.

    It would be interesting to know which modern jazz artists’ work is still widely heard, and performed, 200 years on.

    I’ve been working on some of the Beethoven piano repertoire. Ultimately, he was taking the instrument (piano) and making it sound cool in various ways.

    Same goes for the material written for the symphony orchestra ‘combo’. As Ray Charles said, “What does it sound like? The 9th symphony, 2nd movement is just an incredible thing to hear. Like Count Basie and Sinatra at The Sands, the band is getting down to it.

    • Thanks: GMC
    • Replies: @frankie p
  36. TKK says:

    I have about 30 years left.

    With time running through my hands like water, I’ll be damned if I am going to waste it marching to this obscene new religion of Wokeness and White Hatred.

    It’s bleeding into every facet of our lives. Judges, who used to be reasonable, are bending over backwards to show empathy to black defendants, who are mostly critters. The Bar performs fellatio on any black lawyer who can stutter out a sentence. The manager at the Publix where I shop told me he received a directive last summer to allow black employees to miss work due to the trauma of Floyd dying.

    Music is pure.

    Listening to Ode to Joy by my State Symphony (all shut down the to Covid-19) made me weep. I had to hide my face in the program bulletin.

    Where do we go? Where is safe, affordable and non woke? Or….non insane.

    • Agree: Kolya Krassotkin
  37. I think that Linda Shiver Gleason bitch is dead.

  38. TKK says:
    @exiled off mainstreet

    Have you ever lived with or known a histrionic borderline female?

    They are never happy. They are never satisfied. You could break your back, spend every dime and sacrifice your own health for them to finally fill up that gaping black hole that is their soul, and it never works.

    These people who, by voting for Biden, have given their imprimatur to this insanity, cannot see that this will never end.

    I am not sure they understand that this type of unbridled power mixed with victimhood and stacks of cash for no work, merit or effort is as addictive as heroin.

    There will never be a moment when the dust settles and (they) state: It’s fixed. It’s even. Everything is whole.

    I am not sure what it will take to make white Americans stop working. It is the only form of protest that will get the Important People’s attention- no more taxes to pay for this shakedown.

    • Replies: @Rahan
  39. Beethoven composed “For Elise” in fifteen minutes. He was not even home

    • LOL: R2b
  40. gotmituns says:

    For years and years it was “von” Beethoven and all of a sudden it’s “van” Beethoven. What’s up with that?

    • Replies: @raga10
    , @James O'Meara
  41. Ghali says:

    Isn’t true that Whites “intentionally suppressed” the music of non-White composers? It is easy to see it even today. The world has to be grateful to Black Americans artists and musicians who managed to dominate in the current culture, mostly in the U.S.

    • Troll: V. Hickel
  42. @Schuetze

    They’ve pretty much wiped out rock music anyway… After 2010, pretty much, rock has disappeared at least on the pop channels, and when Bennington and Cornell were whacked, that pretty much sealed rock’s fate. Thank God I can remind folks of rock and roll in my trilogy novels here:
    https://omegabooksnet.com

    And because rock is pretty much dead in the US, I listen to classical, bluegrass, and zydecko. And thank God for Japanese and Asian rock bands…and does it still play in Europe? I hope so.

    • Agree: Old and Grumpy
    • Replies: @Malla
  43. @Authenticjazzman

    Sir, am writing with respect to your locution. As it comes off kind of bare, defensive and conclusory, was wondering whether, ..um…are you … ?

    [sounds of coughing in the back row]

  44. Icy Blast says:

    Ewell is spewing hateful nonsense, as everyone must surely realize. He fails to mention the scores of highly talented, wondrously disciplined, and superbly trained classical musicians, such as Han Soo-jin, who hail from what we used to call “The Orient.” Han Soo-jin is a treasure; Ewell is just a pain in the ass.

  45. I think jazz is awful and it has nothing to do with race.

    In fact if you go to a jazz concert you will at most see one Black guy on the drums.

    It undeniably has a White guilt aspect to it. Just look at how many boomers are into it. For many it is a way to patronize Blacks without getting near them.

    To me it sounds like someone d-king around at a music shop. I like a lot of rock and blues but jazz makes me cringe.

    • Agree: notoneofthem
  46. frankie p says:
    @Scut Farkus

    It would be interesting to know which modern jazz artists’ work is still widely heard, and performed, 200 years on.

    Answer: Bill Evans, another genius of piano that the non-white have always had problems with.

  47. Slate online recently rebuked Beethoven for his mononym: the fact he is known by a single name, like Michelangelo or Shakespeare. This practice supposedly gives the pedestal of nomenclature to “straight white men at the expense of everyone else.”

    just like Hitler. Or Napoleon.

    • Replies: @Franklin Ryckaert
  48. Miha says:
    @Authenticjazzman

    Well of course I completely agree with you but somehow I am reminded of the story of how the playwright Bernard Shaw took a bow on the stage one evening after the performance of one of his plays.

    The applause was overwhelming but in the relative silence when it died down, a single ‘BOO’ was heard coming from the gallery. Shaw’s response: “You and I, Sir, are of the same opinion but what are we against so many?”

  49. Art says:
    @Fidelios Automata

    I am so sick of hearing about racism. Such total BS. Blacks are victims of their own dysfunctional ideology, nothing else!

    Trashing music is not part of black nature and makeup. Blacks have embraced Euro musical instruments and sounds and put them to good use. It is the angry inferior Jew mind, who hates on whites and their music, and encourages black radicals to hate euro musicality.

    The sick Jew cannot allow greatness in others – it is an affront to their self-perceived superiority.

  50. @Authenticjazzman

    Bullshit, LVB is marvelous, otherworldly and immortal, however the melodic wonderworld of one Charlie Parker most certainly does rank up there with LVB’s creations, and is in no way inferior to the ideas of Bach, Mozart or any of the classical titans.

    Mensa certified low IQ street urchin performer negro jizzman is offering us it’s “HIQ” opinions again. LOL

    Remind me of when some english cunts in a pub started saying that Wagner was not on the same level as (((Beatles))). We glassed them.

    But I highly doubt this known kike troll can actually play a plastic recorder, much less jazz. It is just a typical reflexive conditioning when it hears about German achievements.

    • LOL: GeeBee
  51. @Rahan

    China has been producing operas true to Wagner’s vision for a while now. The vocals should be improved, but it is refreshing to see fantastical productions that arent faggot, AIDS ridden perversion made by (((polish))) crews.

    • Thanks: RedpilledAF
    • Replies: @Mustapha Mond
  52. GMC says:

    Ahhh, let’s see, do I wish to listen to some Beethoven, or would I like to listen to the Affirmative Action Rap music? Even Americas music has been Neo-Engineered to piss off the normal refined class that has an ear and good taste – for Music. Maybe the Metropolitan Opera House, should dedicate a solid year to only Rap music – yep, open the doors for all the Homies and then see what the building looks like – after one year. It’ll be great for the neighborhood too ! lol

    • Agree: Biff
  53. @Fluesterwitz

    ““Cyclic nature” is now apparently connoted as Western, white, and male”
    Is it just me or is it hilarious that the original theory that post modernists (cult’ Marxists in Unz speak) are in most part western, white & male? (admittedly if you include the Frankfurt school, it’s also Jewish… inc’ Marx himself…..)

  54. @Authenticjazzman

    No one doubts, at all, that you are very good at tooting your own horn AJM. It’s a gift.

  55. Vojkan says:

    it has “long been an argument of white supremacists, Nazis, Neo-Nazis, and racial separatists that ‘classical music,’ the music of ‘white people,’ is inherently more sophisticated, complicated, and valuable than the musical traditions of Africa, Asia, South America, or the Middle East,

    Well, it is. If you don’t have the ears and the brain to appreciate it, you are free to not listen to it, but if you want to forbid me to appreciate it, go f*ck you.

    thus proving the innate superiority of the ‘white race.’

    Well, imho, it doesn’t. As far as I’m concerned, it only proves that those who use it as an argument against Beethoven are morons.

    In the name of progress, I propose that ‘cultural marxists’ stop listening to music performed on instruments that were invented by white people, and for those among them who are musicians, that they stop playing music on such instruments and that they stop playing tonal music. They should also publicly express their condemnation of such sold-outs to white supremacy as John Coltrane, Charlie Parker or Duke Ellington and now that one of theirs is in the White House, to show that they put money where mouth is, they should send back to Italy the Cristofori’s piano-forte exposed in the NY Metropolitan.

    Actually, they should send back to Europe everything created by white Europeans from the museums in the cities they rule and publicly renounce to use anything invented by white folks. Let’s see where that gets them.

    As I said, morons, suffering from ‘talent envy’.

  56. unwoke says:
    @Verymuchalive

    it doesn’t put us off at all – it draws us in; the whole point of the excellent essay – if you had the good sense to read it – was Beethoven’s continuing centrality to the repertoire in this the 250th anniversary of the year of his blessed birth; & the unwarranted attacks on Him & other white master composers stemming from it.
    On programming, your guess is wrong & the author is correct about that too; in the years before the recent woke attacks, cf.:
    (https://www.bsomusic.org/stories/the-data-behind-the-2016-2017-orchestra-season/)

  57. unwoke says:

    “The attacks on Beethoven in 2020 are yet another example of warfare waged against White people through the construction of culture.”

    More like the DE-struction of culture. Since they’re unable to positively produce anything themselves to rival it, the SJW’s are left to tear down the statues & cancel the masterworks of culture that overshadows them. Pathetic, but they are the losers for it – Beethoven will always serenely tower over them in their petty spite.

  58. dimples says:
    @Rahan

    I attempted to get the Russian quote provided by the buffoon translated in Google but gave up, too difficult. Apparently I have to get translated entire pages of Stalinist waffle. Can the buffoon provide instructions for the translation of the quote only? I am but a simple man with an honest enquiry.

    • Replies: @dimples
  59. Alfred says:

    Ethiopians, that is Negroes …

    Ethiopians have as little in common with Nigerians as Nigerians have with Europeans.

    Oromo Girls

    • Replies: @Mustapha Mond
  60. dimples says:
    @dimples

    Hang on, I’ve got it! Right-click on selection. Aha!

    • LOL: Rahan
  61. Jiminy says:

    This sort of rubbish might gain traction in the US, where so many seem to want a pet black, but out in the real world, white-blacks like Ewell would not even be given a second glance. Upon opening his bigoted mouth, eyes would roll. How is it that self aggrandising white-blacks get so much air time? The chip on their shoulders obviously impedes their way of thinking. But really, if more blacks take on classical music while giving up on rap-crap, then all’s well. Unless of course somebody adapts “w.a.p.” to a Beethoven melody.

  62. Ugetit says:
    @Authenticjazzman

    … I do actually know what I am talking about.

    Good thing you told us.

  63. Schuetze says:

    Jews use Blacks as bullets against whites and Chuck Berry was a jewish bullet fired at Beethoven. Here he says Beethoven was a “good musician” and begs for his forgiveness…

    Berry got his start at Chess Records

    “Established and run by two Jewish immigrant brothers from what was then Poland, Leonard and Phil Chess, the company produced and released many singles and albums regarded as central to the rock music canon.”

  64. Is Beethoven musically superior to a nigger “beating on the bongo like a chimpanzee” (Mark Knopfler)?
    Yes.
    And that’s all there is to say.

    • Replies: @GeeBee
  65. G J T says:
    @Fidelios Automata

    The vast majority of blacks do not even have ideological considerations. They are a victim of their own genetic predispositions and susceptibility to manipulation by hostile forces (i.e. Jews).

    • Replies: @Neuday
  66. zard says:

    Ratchild: Fellow mongrel Semites, its now time to go after our real enemy: the white nationalists/fascists.

    Mongrelstein: We exploited the phony threat of Muslim terrorism for 20 years, our Semitic brothers in the war against whites, now its time to phase it out & replace it with ‘white domestic terrorism’ as the new primary threat to our Judeo-Communist State.

    Sewerberg: Yes, they might eventually oppose our plan of confiscating their guns & relentlessly flooding America with millions & millions of bipedal apes & nonwhites from Africa, Asia & Latin America year after year. So we have to institute the ‘domestic terror’ laws to prevent any possible organized resistance, to their own slavery & white racial demise. Similar to our anti-terror laws we instated in the Soviet Union.

    Dungman: Excellent. What kind of world did these white goy morons expect to inherit after obliterating Hitler & pro-white Nazism?

    • Replies: @Onan the Barbarian
  67. Dumbo says:

    I personally prefer Bach and Mozart, and even Vivaldi, but Beethoven wasn’t too bad.

    Now, they are saying that he was a white supremacist, and that he was a halfrican, wait, aren’t both claims contradictory? Well, anything to put whites down, I suppose.

    Anyway, most blacks listen to rap, very few to classical music, so what’s the complaint.

    • Replies: @Mustapha Mond
    , @36 ulster
  68. @martin_2

    Beethoven was considered the “greatest” composer of all time a century ago. But the invention of the CD has made the works of many other composers available that once were unknown. Nobody with any knowledge of classical music talks that way any more. The nonsense about Ludwig being black is just that, nonsense. There are many portraits of Beethoven available to take the time to look for them, and none show him as black. That is “black nationalist” propaganda.

  69. @zard

    Rioteers: “Kill him, kill him! He’s white! Burn down his house! Beat him to death! He’s white!”
    Kike: “I am not white, I am Jewish!”
    Rioteers (retiring and bowing): “Oh, we did not know that, honorable sir. Our apologies.”
    I do not think that anybody could be daft enough to expect it will work out that way. Not even Suckerberg, whose very face bespeaks his imbecility.

  70. @Expletive Deleted

    Yes, think of it that Martin Luther King is not remembered as “King” only. Da’s rayciss!

  71. ebear says:

    If European music isn’t racist…

    …then why are there more white than black keys on the piano?

    • Replies: @Alden
  72. One could suggest that to get out of the ‘wasteland’ this is required viewing!

    https://larouchepac.com/20201002/how-think-time-crisis-think-beethoven

    [MORE]

    ,

    ,,,,On October 3, 1990, thirty years ago, the nation of Germany was reunified after 45 years. Three years earlier, in August, 1987, Lyndon LaRouche wrote an article entitled: “Will Berlin Become Germany’s Capital Again?” even as he was being unjustly persecuted, through a Boston trial proceeding, by Robert Mueller and others. LaRouche forecasted: “I believe, that if I become US president in 1989… that Berlin might become the capital of a re-unified Germany…. I say this in all seriousness. I say this not to brag, but as a useful way of illustrating a very important point of statecraft for today’s troubled age.”

    There was no “evidence” whatsoever for LaRouche’s forecast at the time. So far as anyone else in 1987 could perceive, the Berlin Wall stood as strong, as defiant, as oppressive and impenetrable then, as it had from when it had first been constructed in 1961. Though Mueller and his henchmen successfully carried out their orders from British Intelligence to put LaRouche in jail in January of 1989, the Berlin Wall fell on November 9 of that same year, and his forecast of German reunification came true less than a year later.

    LaRouche knew how to think in a time of crisis. He refused to be reduced in his thinking to merely focusing on pressing but momentary concerns, even legal concerns. Like Ludwig van Beethoven, LaRouche refused to shrink himself to the size of the mediocre expectations and aspirations of his time, much less the moral level of his opponents. And he believed this quality to be not merely a personal trait, but an intelligible capacity that could be taught to and learned by others.

    • Replies: @John Johnson
  73. xyzxy says:

    So we have a negro, a white woman, and a Jew telling us that white male composers are the problem with culture. How surprising is that?

  74. Alden says:
    @Bill Miller

    One black slave ended up in Russia as an exotic decorative footman, had brains and talent and did very well ending up as General. Well good for him. One exceptional black out of the hundreds of millions of barely human violent dysfunctional useless blacks the European slave dealers loosed on the world.

    There were plenty of talented intelligent native White Russians who became generals and exceptional people.

    One general out of a hundred million. BFD.

    America hasn’t won a war since Truman integrated blacks into combat service in 1948.

    If we had the army then we have now, the Japanese would have won. We’d be lucky if they only took Hawaii.

    • Replies: @lysias
  75. Alden says:
    @ebear

    The white keys are in and of themselves racist.

    • Replies: @Marckus
    , @woof
  76. Rahan says:
    @TKK

    Have you ever lived with or known a histrionic borderline female?
    They are never happy. They are never satisfied. You could break your back, spend every dime and sacrifice your own health for them to finally fill up that gaping black hole that is their soul, and it never works.

    Yup.
    Either a) divorce, or b) violence, or c) apathy/suicide.
    Or d) convincing reassertion of strength

    • Replies: @Alden
  77. Alden says:
    @Rahan

    Nobody wants to putz around clicking back and forth.

    I’ve seen some French and English google translate. It’s pretty bad and not very reliable.

    I often quote a couple French proverbs, always in English. Your clip and paste Russian posts are just pretentious and rude.

    • Replies: @Marckus
    , @Sparkon
  78. moi says:
    @raga10

    He is just Ludwig Van in the great movie “A Clockwork Orange?”

  79. @Alfred

    That is a lovely smile and bright, sparkling eyes. Thank you.

  80. @Dumbo

    “I personally prefer Bach and Mozart, and even Vivaldi”

    Wonderful combinations of structure, poetry and lyricism. Faves of mine as well.

    But when I need gut-churning, spine-tingling, bring-down-the-house emotion, Beethoven, Brahms and of course, Wagner, are all on tap. And others, obviously, but since we are talking in threes…..

    Thankfully, computer audio puts all of them, and every other musical genre one could imagine, at our fingertips, unlike any other time in history.

    Life is good. Live it!

  81. @raga10

    Ima gonna hold out for Curtis James Johnson, III. (50 Cent)

    • Replies: @Escher
  82. @mark green

    Add Schoenberg to that list. No one has done more to defile and destroy the beauty of music, in my estimation, and he should be reviled rather than celebrated.

    Felix Mendelssohn, on the other hand, especially his early works and his symphonies, is under-appreciated, IMHO. A truly delightful composer that I love dearly. The Italian Symphony is pure joy, as is his violin concerto. And I recognize Mahler’s genius, although he is simply too long-winded for me much of the time.

    But Schoenberg? Twelve-tone (originated by Hauer, btw) atonal composition?

    No thanks!

    • Agree: cronkitsche
  83. Marckus says:

    If you listen to the black man civilisation and everything associated with it originated in Africa.

    I would not be surprised to hear Beethoven travelled to Africa and after hearing their drums and one string instruments was inspired to write his symphonies.

    The waltz most likely also originated in the Congo when whites saw the naked natives jumping and hollering.

    Blacks are like lost souls. They accomplished nothing and but claim benefit for everything.

    • Replies: @cronkitsche
    , @Truth
  84. Marckus says:
    @Alden

    The tide washes us some strange objects on this site. Rahan is one with his Russian language clip and copy.

    Maybe if we give him a liver treat, a rawhide bone to chew on and a pat on the head, he may be convinced we care. We will have to learn to say Sit Boy in Russian just in case.

    • Replies: @Rahan
  85. Alden says:
    @Rahan

    Why don’t all you bitter divorced guys form your own support group. Or join a support group for bitter divorced guys.

  86. Any day now, a turkey breast sandwich will be declared racist and probably sexist by somebody with a Humanities or Social Sciences degree.

    • Replies: @theMann
    , @V. Hickel
  87. Marckus says:
    @Alden

    Your comment could well result in blacks destroying every piano or worse changing the white keys to brown.

    That might be racist though as it would seem to favour Hispanics who, according to Farrakhan, will soon be taking over the US.

    A compromise would be to make all pianos including the keys as well as the sheet music, black.

  88. Defcon says:

    The African’s only history are the horrors recorded by European explorers, due to them not having a written language. This pathetic attempt at appropriating European music is as bad as them accusing white women with braids of appropriating black “culture” while having a Chinese girls hair glued to the pubes on their heads.

    • Agree: NoobSpyBot
    • Replies: @NoobSpyBot
  89. “2020 was meant to be a year of celebration for Beethoven who was baptized 250 years ago (his exact date of birth is unknown) in Bonn on December 17, 1770. COVID-19 prompted the cancelation of commemorative concerts of Beethoven’s music, but the pandemic didn’t quell efforts by anti-White activists to attack the composer’s reputation and dominant place in the cultural pantheon of the West. Rather than a year full of performances of the great composer’s sonatas, string quartets, concertos and symphonies, 2020 saw repeated attacks on Beethoven for the crime of being a White male genius and for embodying the European musical tradition.”

    I got through this paragraph then thought better of it! that’s it! I am done!

    I love Beethoven’s music anyway, all of it that I know and that’s a lot of it. and I am not white! I will not get into all this racist nonsense about Beethoven. which people of color are or would be jealous of Beethoven as a white man of genius?

    one reason I do not get to Beethoven as often as I might like…or want to.. is that there is so much more great, modern, current and popular music for me to devour with my time: music just as beautiful and brilliant as Beethoven’s historical trove

    that it! I just spoke o my google music machine to play me some Jeffery Osborne and it tuned me into Spotify and I am off for the day musically. at some point later on I will get them to play the |Ninth for me.

  90. mirpaz says:

    From the perspective of an old black woman: All the discussions that some of my brothers and sisters are doing (here in Canada a TO influencer Sasha Exeter) and telling things, which undermine the most important issue for all oppressed people, regardless of skin colour, birth of origin, height, weight, what they decide to do in their bedrooms (with consensual age partners), people with mental and physical problems, old (like me, who has mobility problems)… I never met any of this people that are going around and accusing a different culture of what ever.

    Why I say this: 1 – It is not addressing the issues that are underlying the problems; 2 – It brings disruptions on the path to create a better world, stop destruction of all earth kingdoms; 3 – Put more power (more money for police to be more violent, more money for creating more conflicts, wars, discriminations, destruction of the constitutions in most countries and the rule of law is gone) and money in their pockets which is distributed (from our hard earning cash) by the likes of Dubya, Obama, Clinton, Trump, Harper (in Canada) and Trudeau.

    Most of us regardless of “group one belongs to) are doing menial jobs (if we find them, to be able to feed and shelter ourselves and our families.

    What is to be a influencer? Some sort of flu spreader or flu container? What any of the people bringing about all this discord, has done that is noble, can be used as role model, has helped all members of our communities and make the planet less destroyed?

    I, an old black female, poor (in Canada pensions are very small if you had children and placed your children first). If on top of it your husband died early and you didn’t get welfare, but went working in cleaning and other menial jobs…you are very poor and luck to have a roof over your head.

    J. trudeau, has followed harper’s path. Harper put a cap on how much pension one could get, in order to satisfy the private pension providers.
    My point is not one of these influencers and writers, have done more than most people do: “Take care of themselves and their interests which includes to praise Raken, Miese, the chicago boys of disaster economics).”

    There was a time, when black people helped each other to change our plight. Today the ones (like OBAMA) use us like some cristians use Jesus a tool to power and support to the monied oligarchs.
    Let’s change our minds and ignore these influencers; they are sick in their hearts and let them disappear in the tunnel of forgetfulness where they were hiding. God is not asleep, their pay back time is rolling and they will have to reckon with their odious behaviour

    Let’s do our best to uplift our communities, with gardens, friendliness, help to young people to learn a trade, to play an instrument, let’s to get together and share meals. Monoculture kills. Monoculture demands lots of round up and other killers of the soil, water, air and have helped many humans into the cancer’s wards of all countries.
    Diversity will thrive better in a friendly and respectful society. For me all of discussions are important; however, more important is to have a community where we all feel like brothers and sisters, as per Jesus instructions.

  91. anon[148] • Disclaimer says:

    “In every field of human endeavor, he that is first must perpetually live in the white glare of publicity. Whether the leadership be vested in a man or in a manufactured product, emulation and envy are ever at work. In art, in music, in industry, the reward and punishment are always the same. The reward is widespread recognition; the punishment, fierce denial and detraction. When a man’s work becomes a standard for the whole world, it also becomes a target for the shafts of the envious few. If his work is mediocre, he will be left severely alone—if he achieves a masterpiece, it will set a million tongue a-wagging. Jealousy does not protrude its forked tongue at the artist who produces a commonplace painting. Whatsoever you write, or paint, or play, or sing, or build, no one will strive to surpass or to slander you unless your work be stamped with the seal of genius. Long, long after a great work or a good work has been done, those who are disappointed or envious, continue to cry out that it cannot be done. Spiteful little voices in the domain of art were raised against our own Whistler as a mountebank, long after the big would have acclaimed him its greatest artistic genius. Multitudes flocked to Bayreuth to worship at the musical shrine of Wagner, while the little group of those whom he dethroned and displaced argued angrily that he was no musician at all. The little world continued to protest that Fulton could never build a steamboat, while the big world flocked to the river banks to see his boat steam by. The leader is assailed because he is the leader, and the effort to equal him is merely added proof of that leadership. Failing to equal or excel, the follower seeks to depreciate and to destroy—but only confirms once more the superiority of that which he strives to supplant. There is nothing new in this. It is as old as the world and as old as human passions—envy, fear, greed, ambition, and the desire to surpass. And it all avails nothing. If the leader truly leads, he remains—the leader. Master-poet, master-painter, master-workman, each in his turn is assailed, and each holds his laurels through the ages. That which is good or great makes itself known, no matter how loud the clamor of denial. That which deserves to live—lives.”

    Copyright Cadillac Motor Company

  92. AKINDLE says:

    So Beethoven was “black”? This is the kind of junk article to be expected on the UNZ website which promotes the nation of islam and other black filth.

  93. gotmituns says:

    At 14:50, Kristen Flagstad’s voice completely merges with the music and becomes one with it. A completely stunning performance.

    WAGNER – Tristan und Isolde: Prelude & Liebestod (Furtwängler/Flagstad)

    Watch video

    18:15

    WAGNER – Tristan und Isolde: Prelude & Liebestod (Furtwängler/Flagstad)

  94. TJ M says:
    @raga10

    Don’t tell them about Josquin — that was just his first name!

  95. When all they can do is destroy and denigrate then they’re essentially admitting they have nothing to offer.

  96. @Fidelios Automata

    More like victims of their entitled single mothers, whose only ideology is mixture of twerking and gimme dat.

  97. Sparkon says:
    @Alden

    Nobody wants to putz around clicking back and forth.

    Then you should stay off the Internet until you learn how to use it to its full potential, and meanwhile keep your ignorant opinions to yourself.

    You could say “I don’t want to putz around clicking…” and that would be fine because its your choice.

    But when you claim to speak for everyone – “Nobody wants to…” – it’s a mouth too big and far, because you speak only for yourself, but you do confirm your generally anti-intellectual stance, which has been my impression of you from early on here at UR, when you refused to acknowledge the difference between the nominative and objective cases in English — who whom?

    At any rate, even though I do speak some Russian, it’s usually faster and easier for me to let Google do its thing, so here you are:

    The Red Army has as its goal the expelling of the German occupiers from our country and the liberation of Soviet land from the German fascist invaders. It is very likely that the war for the liberation of Soviet land will lead to the expulsion or destruction of the Hitler clique. We would welcome such an outcome. But it would be ridiculous to identify Hitler’s clique with the German people, with the German state. The experience of history says that Hitlers come and go, but the German people, and the German state remains.

    — Iosef Stalin

    Note that Stalin, the Soviets and Russians generally do not use the term Nazi, but rather refer to the invading WWII Germans as the Hitler clique, Hitlerites, or fascists.

    All subsequent European musical art up to the present day developed dialectically from the principles laid down in Beethoven’s music. Only with October, only in our country, did the broad masses of working people finally become those desired listeners for whom the lofty ideals of heroism, will, struggle, creative enthusiasm, social truth and fraternal solidarity put forward by Beethoven became a matter of life, became an everyday reality.

    — Unknown Soviet speechwriter

    As always, attempts to tie music with politics and/or ideology do not ring true.

    Now for my opinion, which holds that Franz Josef Haydn was by far the greatest classical composer with the added advantage that his music is just as good as it sounds.

    • Disagree: Schuetze
    • Thanks: Rahan
    • Replies: @Alden
    , @Swan knight
  98. @Abdul Alhazred

    LaRouche was a nutcase cult leader.

    I ran into his cult on campus once. They would try to talk students into dropping out for his cause.

    • Replies: @Abdul Alhazred
  99. I have been a classical music nut since six years of age, when I began sneaking my father’s classical albums into my room to play on my crappy hand-me-down mono record player that my much older brother had no use for (as he had gotten a stereo player for Christmas.)

    In my late teens I heard Beethoven’s first piano concerto that I had borrowed from the library and was astonished to notice a rhythm that immediately struck me as ‘rumba-like’. It briefly appeared twice in the first movement (as I recall), and so was no accident. It’s clear South Americanesque dance rhythm was astonishing to me. Was Beethoven exposed to such rhythms and inserted it out of experimentation and appreciation for its novelty and attractiveness? Or had he come up with such completely on his own, from his staggering musical genius creativity we have all been exposed to? I did not know, and admittedly, gave up on finding an answer, as I was young and had many other things on my mind, mostly girls.

    Many years later, I was lucky enough to count as my closest friend at the time a world-class string player who sat as assistant principle for (what was then) one of the world’s ‘top ten’ orchestras. The Beethoven first piano concerto was on the schedule that year and during the performance my mind recalled the question I had about that curious, infectious rumba-like rhythm I had heard years ago, and after the concert I asked my friend about it.

    He laughed and said, “That’s pretty well-known and the orchestra members sometimes joke that we really should have a Carmen Miranda lookalike dance out when that part is played.” So, obviously, I wasn’t hallucinating. But where did it come from?

    My friend offered a hint: “Take a good look at the death and life masks of Beethoven, the ones that are undisputed. A lot of people think he probably had a bit of African somewhere in his lineage. Maybe that’s where it came from. Who knows?”

    So, this being before the internet age, I dutifully trudged down to the huge central library and found a book on the life/death masks of famous people, and found to my surprise that there were a few masks of Beethoven, both live and after death. And I had to admit, the thick full lips and broad nose had a somewhat African flavor. Not like current icon of the left, the late George Floyd, but enough that I had come to the conclusion there might be something to this.

    But that left me to puzzle: is music somehow inherent in our genes, and do we have a natural tendency to like and create in a certain way that found similar expression in our ancestors and their peoples? Was Beethoven’s rumba-like rhythm in his first piano concerto innately discovered and expressed, or simply just another of his creative leaps that defines genius in all its expressions? I certainly don’t know, and doubt anyone ever will.

    I know that I have a deeply felt emotional attachment that brings tears to my eyes frequently when I hear slavic music, as that is my background nearly 100%. Just yesterday, I found tears welling up listening to “Die Moldau” from “Ma Vlast” by Bedrich Smetana, the celebrated Bohemian composer, as it stirred emotions deeply held in my heart, as it always does. The same with Dvorak’s “Slavonic Dances” and Chopin’s “Mazurkas”, the latter especially when done by the likes of Ivan Moravec.

    To my mind, it doesn’t matter one whit if Beethoven had any African blood. He was a God of classical composition, and I will forever love his music and always be appreciative of his genius he so richly shared with us, as did so many great composers we owe such enormous thanks to for enriching our lives…….

    (And screw the cultural marxists who want to despoil such treasures. They’re simply obnoxious assholes, the lot of them.)

    • Thanks: Mark G.
    • Replies: @Schuetze
  100. Escher says:
    @Jim Bob Lassiter

    I raise you an Eminem.

    • Replies: @Truth
  101. @Marckus

    Most blacks are lost souls. We can’t change their history. The most humane response to their distress in White civilization is separation. But we can’t change our history either, and our forebears chose democracy instead of monarchy. A monarch would have carried out the separation.

  102. @Fidelios Automata

    “Blacks are victims of their own dysfunctional ideology, nothing else!”

    Au contraire, mon frere! They (((Blacks))) are not victims of anything. They are simply inheritors of their predecessors’ DNA.

    • Agree: Tom
  103. GeeBee says:
    @HeebHunter

    Thanks for that Heeb old buddy. I am still laughing at your wonderfully mischievous and amusing post. Cheered me up no end sir. (I hadn’t realised that this ‘Authenticjizzman’ was a regular here.)

    • Thanks: HeebHunter
  104. GeeBee says:
    @Onan the Barbarian

    One wonders whether if Mark Knopfler were not Jewish he’d have been allowed to get away with that lyric!

    • Thanks: Tom
  105. Trinity says:

    You forgot da Vinci and of course The King Of Rock & Roll, Elvis, both are known by one name. Of course the negro has one guy, Ali, who was the self proclaimed greatest of all time in boxing, greatest heavyweight but not the greatest fighter IMO. The Jew has the fraud, Einstein. The American Indian has Geronimo, but then again, Injuns back then didn’t have last names to the best of my knowledge. However, when you say Geronimo, people know the person by a singular name. Other people whether infamous or famous who are known by one name, Nero, Caligula, Hitler, Stalin, Churchill, Custer, Lincoln, Washington, Jefferson, Manson, Bundy, Gacy, Dahmer, Liberace, Oprah, just to name some that come to mind immediately. And of course, the most famous man/God to ever walk the earth, Jesus. I am sure there are numerous others that I could think of if I truly racked my medulla oblongata.

    • LOL: Tom
  106. @HeebHunter

    In China, it seems the traditional is still revered and appreciated, despite also rushing headlong into a technologically advanced future.

    Thanks.

  107. MR says:

    I wish these POC critics of Whiteness would stop writing in English.

    Their use of English both contributes to the perpetuation of the white-male frame in their own academic work and counts as an example of cultural appropriation.

    Let them publish, say, in Swahili.

  108. Truth says:
    @HeebHunter

    We glassed them.

    Welcome to the board, Limey Dereck:

  109. Truth says:
    @Marckus

    The waltz most likely also originated in the Congo when whites saw the naked natives jumping and hollering.

    No, but European foreplay did.

  110. Schuetze says:
    @Mustapha Mond

    When I was in 8th grade in a boys school back around 1970, we were forced to attend Music class one day a week. Although a lot of the class was about technical details of music like scales and reading music, a lot of it was what one could call “music appreciation”. The old man who taught the course was reportedly an ex-british navy captain whose minehunter hit a mine and was sunk losing most of the crew.

    He would wave his head ecstatically in a kind of trance as we were forced to sit and endure all kinds of opera, classical music and even chamber music. Every class would end the same way, we would be giggling and making fun of him and the music, he would become furious, and he would go after one or more of the boys and physically abuse them by twisting their ears, whacking their hands with his baton, or even grabbing two boys by their hair and banging their heads together. Of course this never made any of us appreciate the music or sit still for that matter. He and his class was a constant source of amusement during recess and sports when we got to do what we loved, run around and rough house.

    Of course in our dorm rooms we also had mono, and some even stereo record players. There things like Rolling Stones, Jethro Tull, even Ozzy Osborne were played at sound levels beyond which their low power amps and tinny speakers could handle.

    I do remember one boy who was the music teachers pet. He used to play piano at various concerts and school events. The poor kid had a miserable existence because everyone made fun of him. He also sat in the front of music class and never got abused by the music teacher. Was that you?

    • LOL: Truth
    • Replies: @Truth
    , @Mustapha Mond
  111. Truth says:
    @Escher

    I raise you an Eminem.

    You’re supposed to write his original name here in order to follow the gestalt of the joke, dummy.

  112. theMann says:
    @RoatanBill

    Turkey and Feta cheese sandwich – now dat’s raciss!!

  113. woof says: • Website
    @Alden

    Sorry the keys are not white, they are ivory.

  114. AReply says:

    If only this article had some views on why the author appreciates this music.

    Zizek has a good riff about how everybody thinks Ode to Joy speaks their specific cultural majesty, inc the Third Reich, Mao’s China and EU.

    The Pervert’s Guide to Ideology

    But true to unzcom form, the only important aspect of Beethoven and his work is as a strawman for how denigrated and oppressed are whites, esp given white genius. Really unfair for white people…

    And “As every Cultural Marxist knows…” (Wait, wha??)

    The Cadillac ad copy was a nice toss. Not sure if the poster knows he’s being ironic.

    • Replies: @Schuetze
  115. Tom says:

    Critical race theorists like Linda Shaver Gleason* always get away with condemning an entire race (European Gentiles) by assigning it with collective negative traits. CRT is the tool they use to do this. While Jewish talent seems to have manifested largely in commerce, music, entertainment, journalism, the theatre, and in duplicitous cultural/economic/art theory, they have never been, to my knowledge, builders of anything like bridges, buildings, ships, highway systems, trains and autos. Can anyone dispute this? I’d like some input.

    The art swindle known as Abstract Expressionism was crafted by Clement Greenberg and other Jewish Intellectuals. They hyped garbage art and invented a lucrative false market. Rothko’s moronic squares sell for 100’s of millions today. Jews never asserted themselves as classical realist painters, so they sought to devalue it as best they could, it seems. Constructors of revolution, practitioners in The Industry of Slander and deconstructors of Euro- civilization. My guess is that hyping garbage, modernist, rhythmless and formless music is their eventual musical aim as well. They likely are big Hip Hop promoters.

    This late Beethoven-hater must certainly have realized that all the instruments used in a concert of any size were the result of White Man’s genius and craftsmanship in either inventing an instrument outright (saxophone, piano, etc.) or reinventing it to maximum facility (drums). She should’ve burnt her Ph.D. That scholastic designation of achievement was certainly a European construct of meritocracy. And all musicians who denounce European achievement should throw away their instruments, and just stand there and sing. Or just shut the fuck up. They should also refrain from crossing a bridge or traversing a highway on the way to the concert or studio. Indeed, they ought not use the recording studios at all. If these necessities are not European Constructs, I don’t know what is.

    *These trouble-making malcontents always seem to have three names!

    • Replies: @36 ulster
    , @Sidney
  116. Schuetze says:
    @AReply

    Is Zizek a jew?

    That was a fascinating video, but it reminds me of why I always hated English as a class in school. Inevitably you would have some bimbo brainiac going on and on about all the “hidden symbolism” and “messages” that the author was secretly trying to get across. I specifically remember Hemmingway’s “old man and the sea”, spending weeks going on over what message Hemmingway was trying to transmit. Another was the “Scarlet Letter”. My god, what tripe we were forced to endure. Even “The Great Gatsby” or “Catcher in the Rye”.

    This is one reason why I went into computer science and engineering, but nowadays the jew has transformed “science” into the same kind of politically correct rituals. The “Scientific Method” is now little more than regurgitating some faggy jews dogma about “global warming”, “pandemic” or even “vaccine efficacy”.

  117. Corrupt says:

    Jealousy as they know their rap XXXX isn’t music, and they are incapable of reaching the level of creativity that the great western composers have.

  118. lysias says:
    @Alden

    That exceptional black’s grandson was one of the greatest writers the world has known. I wonder why these black nationalists, instead of dreaming up a black ancestry for Beethoven, don’t publicize the one-eighth- black Alexander Pushkin and the one-quarter-black Dumas pere.

  119. Truth says:
    @Schuetze

    Of all the different varieties of insult humor, nothing quite hits the spot like a white man ridiculing another white man for “actin’ white!”

    • Replies: @Mustapha Mond
  120. lysias says:

    Beethoven’s Fidelio is the greatest celebration of liberation from oppression of which I am aware in any art.

    Galina Vishnevskaya’s autobiography says that, when the Bolshoi performed Fidelio in her younger years, the artists involved thought of it as a protest against Stalinism.

  121. I read somewhere that:

    Although Europe represents only about 8 percent of the planet’s landmass, from 1492 to 1914, Europeans conquered or colonized more than 80 percent of the entire world.

    A pretty good run. If you went to college in the USA in recent decades you are probably really pissed off about it. Four hundred years of conquering. The nerve! These conquering Europeans were White, Christian and evil. Like Beethoven, Orange Man and Your’s Truly.

    Beethoven is out of harm’s way. Vengence is wanted against White Christians who are living now. Wanted by idiots, usefull to the Ruling Class.

    Homeschool your children lest they murder you in your sleep.

    Orange Lives Matter.

    Stop The Hate
    Separate

  122. I think a year of celebrating the great, classical Black and Jewish maestros is in order. Now, who are they?

  123. @Defcon

    Every reader of Unz Review must read Helper’s “Negroes in Negroland”!

  124. @Schuetze

    Nope, that wasn’t me. I loved classical as my heart’s favorite, but there was the other side of me, the side that like rocking and rolling.

    In fact, I was the go-to guy at the high school for all things musical. I always had a job, so I had an awesome quad stereo by then, was an Emerson, Lake and Palmer, Yes devotee (my personal faves, given my classical inclinations), but with 500+ rock albums, I had all the Beatles, Stones, Tull, Black Sabbath, Zeppelin, Hendrix, etc., etc., and even enjoyed some of the pop-ish stuff like Elton John, Jim Croce, so I was very eclectic. I simply loved all music.

    So, having the best stereo and biggest music collection in the school (and money), my house was ‘party central’, which my folks were cool with, as long as no marijuana could be smelled coming from the bedroom (there was the nearby elementary school for that!) and I maintained a 4.0 gpa (which I did, and in college, too.) Hard work pays off.

    My folks gave me lots of leeway to live life to the fullest, as long as I worked (and paid room and board), went to school (and maintained my gpa), and always respected them (no lipping off or being an asshole.) All of which I happily did. I was a good kid. Why not be?

    Like I say, life is good. Enjoy it while you got it……..

    • Replies: @Schuetze
  125. @Truth

    See my response to Schuetze.

    Living well is the best revenge…….

  126. R2b says:
    @lloyd

    Adolph did have some good points, never denied that!

  127. Joe Cool says:

    I think it’s fairly obvious…the real genius was Kurt Cobain

  128. R2b says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    Well said. Beethoven is great, but had giants behind him! He began a subjective slope in classical music.

  129. @AKINDLE

    The author is not stating that Beethoven was black, he’s merely reporting the assertions made by certain blacks that this was case. And he (the author) clearly is not sympathetic to said assertions.
    Next time try actually reading the article, stupid.

  130. raga10 says:
    @gotmituns

    I don’t know, it was always “van” in my parts of the world. But “von” does pop up here and there, and I found this explanation:

    “The ‘van’ in Beethoven’s surname is similar to the Scottish use of ‘Mac’ in their surnames, for example MacMillan. Here the ‘Mac’ means basically ‘son/daughter of’ and the ‘van’ in Beethoven’s name serves a similar purpose, although here it could be taken to mean simply ‘of’ rather than ‘son of’, to indicate the place Beethoven came from. The word ‘Beethoven’ (actually two words) is Flemish for ‘beetroot farms’ or ‘beet fields’ (his ancestors were Belgian beet farmers).

    Sometimes Beethoven’s name was mistakenly written or spoken as ‘von’ by others, and Beethoven was in no hurry to correct this mistake, as ‘von’ indicated a person of noble/royal descent, whereas ‘van’ betrayed his more humble origins.”

    • Replies: @Expletive Deleted
  131. Okay, let the non-whites reject our music. Then they must also reject our musical instruments.

  132. “Slate online recently rebuked Beethoven for his mononym: the fact he is known by a single name, like Michelangelo or Shakespeare.”

    What about Gandhi, Nehru, Tojo, Hirohito, Mao, Confucius, Mandela, Amin, Nasser, Gaddafi, Castro et al? We ain’t complaining… Slate Magazine has no business bitching about the most talented of all humans: Beethoven!

  133. Beethoven’s spirit of heroic individualism is quintessentially white/Western…though if he’d been Jewish, E. Michael Jones would probably say he was channeling the Jewish revolutionary spirit. (Beethoven was the most musically revolutionary artist ever.)

    By the way, since we’re racists if we just call him “Beethoven,” are we allowed to keep calling Coltrane “Coltrane”?

  134. Trinity says:

    The thing is this, Jews, have produced little to nothing of any value in this world and they wish to destroy Western Civilization. Jews also for the most part are a very lazy people, hence the work camps that they were sent to during WWII. IF any group of people despise work more than the negro it is in fact the Jew. Laziness might be a Middle Eastern thing as well, Arabs are also a lazy lot. Curiously the negro often adopts the religion of the Arab which baffles my mind to no end. The Arab abused the negro far worse than any other group and yet the negro thinks he or she is sticking it to the man by adopting Islam as his or her religion, DUH. Another thing that baffles me is the White man’s subservience to the Jew, particularly since MOST Jews are either atheists or are anti-Christ, they do not believe in Christ and more than a few blaspheme the symbol of Christianity in some of the most vile and despicable ways imaginable. Jews and/or Arabs are stone age people IMO, and they both deserve each other in that giant sandbox called the Middle East. The Middle East is easily the most unsightly place on the face of the earth. Perfect place for two stone age infidels to fight each other as long as they wish.

    Elvis Presley, the Jewish equivalent is Neil Diamond. LMAO.
    Patsy Cline, the Jewish equivalent is Babs Streisand. LMAO Or even more laughable Carol King.
    Michelangelo, the Jewish equivalent is ? A Jewish painter is an oxymoron
    Michael Phelps, the Jewish equivalent is Mark Spitz. Hmm, the Jews finally are competitive. Still the nod goes to the “Baltimore Bullet” though.

    Jews are not good athletes but there have been a few, most notably Mark Spitz and Benny Leonard, along with Sandy Koufax, Hank Greenberg, Dave Rigert, Ike Berger, and half Jews like Lyle Alzado and Mike Rossman.

    Sports and old school soul, R&B, etc., are about the only contributions that Blacks have contributed, so it isn’t like Blacks did anything that major in helping to build America.

    When you count the destruction that Blacks, Jews and other nonwhites have brought to America, that far outweighs the minor contributions that these groups have made. Hell, these groups OWE WHITES REPARATIONS in TRILLIONS of dollars.

    • Replies: @Schuetze
  135. @raga10

    Great musicians are of course called”van”. Van Halen, Van Morrison, Townes van Zandt.

    • Replies: @raga10
    , @notoneofthem
  136. Schuetze says:
    @Mustapha Mond

    Wow, you sound almost as perfect as Donald Trump! /snark.

    My uncle once told me: “The one who has the most toys when he dies, wins”. Lately I have been much more of the opinion that our generation has enjoyed life far too much and not suffered nearly enough. Nietsche would likely agree.

    Where do you live Mustapha, do you have grand children?

    • Replies: @Mustapha Mond
  137. Emslander says:

    So, just shoot me and get it over with.

  138. 36 ulster says:
    @Schuetze

    Not to mention shields against whites.

  139. Schuetze says:
    @Trinity

    Einstein and Oppenheimer invented the atom bomb and killed hundreds of thousands of Japanese. How great is that! Go ahead and out do that, stupid goy cattle.

    Jews also assassinated the Tsar and Crown Prince Ferdinand! Nobody starts world wars and revolutions better than jews. Put that in your peace pipe and smoke it.

    • Troll: GeneralRipper
    • Replies: @Trinity
    , @GeneralRipper
  140. raga10 says:
    @Expletive Deleted

    Heh, yes – that came about because musicians tended to start their careers by touring, usually in a van.

  141. Laudatory references to White male geniuses like Beethoven inevitably trigger rage from anti-White commentators who huff that it has “long been an argument of white supremacists, Nazis, Neo-Nazis, and racial separatists that ‘classical music,’ the music of ‘white people,’ is inherently more sophisticated, complicated, and valuable than the musical traditions of Africa, Asia, South America, or the Middle East, thus proving the innate superiority of the ‘white race.’”

    Huh?

    But, everything produced by members of the “white race”- and here I mean the best works- is better: music, architecture, painting, sculpture, philosophy, imaginative literature, sciences exact & social, technology….

    Everything.

  142. @Authenticjazzman

    Jazz is crap. Discordant crap. Classical music outsells all other types of music combined so it is better. The only way to judge something like music is by sales and jazz sales are always at the bottom. Jazz gets the same treatment as rap. People pretend it is good.

    I know what I’m talking about because up to this year I have played a min of 50 gigs a year for over 3 decades.

    Jazz sucks and cool jazz (the only kind that sells) is not really jazz because all the musicians stay in key. Jazz was the first way jews elevated talent less blacks in music.

    • Replies: @Truth
  143. 36 ulster says:
    @Dumbo

    Bach, Haydn and Handel are some personal favorites, and the fact that many of them had patrons doesn’t detract a bit from my appreciation of their works. Yet I’m appreciative of this article, which reminds us of the struggles Beethoven had to endure. One story has it that when his Ninth Symphony premiered at the Kaertnertor Theatre in Vienna, a deaf Beethoven was “conducting” the orchestra while the real conductor guided the musicians from a concealed position. Talk about adding insult (or indignity) to injury. The attempt to emasculate the European greats should come as no surprise; the Revenge of he Nerds has “inspired” revolts of the small, shallow, ghoulish, grotesque, and incompetent.

  144. An argument could be made for the equality or superiority of the Hindu or Chinese traditions, but these guys and gals aren’t making it. (See Alain Danielou). Traditionalist also hate Beethoven; Frithjof Schoun (John Tavener’s guru) said of Beethoven “Some music ought not to have been made.”

    This goes along with the whole “Fall of Western Man since the Renaissance”. Richard Weaver, for instance (jazz was worse than Beethoven, but only because it continued the degeneration that started in 1300). Cf. E Michael Jones, and presumably Nick Fuentes and other “Trad Caths”.

    The character of Chaim Breitsacher in Thomas Mann’s Dr. Faustus is a satire of the “call yourself conservative because you like Bach? Hold my beer…” stream of thought; where the intellectual extremism and atavistic primitivism (as Mann sees it) that led to the rise of Hitler is explored through a series of grotesque figures in intellectual Munich, such as the painter Baptist Spengler (Oswald Spengler having thought painting an impossible art under modern circumstances), Daniel zur Hohe (author of a single book, on “hand-made paper” ; a “lyrico-rhetorical outburst of voluptuous terrorism”; Stefan George?), and the polymath “private scholar” Dr. Chaim Breisacher (a “corrosively ugly” Jewish version Evola, based on the once fashionable now forgotten Oscar Goldberg, sneering at the very idea of “progress” in a world declining since Solomon built his temple).

    “As for von Riedesel, he had fallen prey to utter confusion. ‘Beg pardon’ he said, ‘if you please . . . Bach, Palestrina . . .’ For him those names possessed the nimbus of conservative authority, and now they had been assigned to the realm of modernistic disintegration. . . . According to [Breisacher], decline, stultification, and the loss of all feeling for what was old and genuine had begun early on and in a place so respectable that no one would ever have dreamt it.”

    Ludwig Klages is another conservative as barbarian, popular with the Arktos crowd; he was caricatured in Musil’s The Man Without Qualities. Both Mann and Musil were sceptical on the advisability of responding to a cultural crisis by jumping feet-first into some kind of primitivistic “rapture.”

    It’s interesting that all these people are Catholics or Jews, and all quite respectable within the “Right.”

    • Replies: @raga10
    , @Bardon Kaldian
  145. L Bean says:

    I read Alan Lomax’s bio of Jelly Roll Morton several years ago. He said he and the other New Orleans jazz pioneers, in their early years, would eavesdrop on the performances at the Opera House, and often incorporated classical opera themes in later compositions. He mentioned Donizetti being a favorite. Also, before the Jazz age, there was the phenomenon of brothel musicians – and the brothel patrons would not want to listen to negro spirituals or worksongs or whatever, they’d expect..well, Donizetti, on the upright.

    (side note, the New Orleans opera house in early American context was the absolute center of high culture, anywhere – well established before NYC was even NYC let alone a cultural center. Many European operas were first debuted in the states there, with their full Euro casts, these were the main events aside from the traditional balls held there – so it follows that New Orleans would retain a serious music culture, regardless of what it is in modern times)

    Music has never been truly un-cosmopolitan. Good music needs no translation, and cannot be highjacked for these control-like purposes, imho. But now you have these SJW people in increasingly close, crowded competition w each other, and the name of the game is ‘new material’; who has the new angle, who has the new schtick. So the resulting new products are increasingly vapid, as well as being non-contextual by necessity. They know their audience though; increasingly vapid.

    Another point, for these idiots – a great deal of what is considered European classical music is derived from peasant folk songs, going back through the ages, often it could be argued, to prehistory. Most classical European composers openly admitted to doing this, there was no concept of music ownership (of an enforceable status at least) in this era. The great composers of yore would laugh at the concept of special promotion of class-specific diversely-abled musicians, as well. They knew they were at the end of it all paid entertainers, even if it was like, the king paying them. They worked their asses off.

  146. @John Johnson

    So now you don’t have to be afraid and can watch the video…then tell me why Mueller was deployed to put him in jail on orders of Henry Kissinger working as an agent of the British Home Office.

  147. ” led to the establishment of new norms of concert behavior. These norms — sitting still, staying quiet and not clapping mid-piece — led to the strict culture of classical music that persists to this day, and which allegedly oppresses non-Whites who cannot reasonably be expected to conform to such standards of behavior. ”

    For purposes of argument, I will only assume I am of normal intelligence; and yet I can easily see this makes no sense. If White people learned to behave differently, then they must have been more or less behaving just like non-Whites. So, why can’t non-Whites also learn such “conformity?”

    This would also be consistent with the claim that “we’re all the same” or “there are no races.” But this argument actually proves the opposite: non-Whites are different than Whites, at least to the extent of not being able to “conform” to the new standard.

    Of course, this assumes the authors of these statements are ingenuous. In fact, although they are “scholars” writing in “scholarly” or at least supposedly serious publications, they are in fact simply uttering whatever they think will gain them social points; increasing their social credit score.

    While we’re on the subject of “races” let’s point out that “natural rhythm” is a myth. So-called “swing” was invented by Louis Armstrong. We know this because the NYC gangsters behind the Cotton Club fought with the Chicago mob to bring Armstrong to NYC to teach “swing” to Fletcher Henderson, whose “All Negro Harlem Orchestra” surely didn’t need such instruction, right?

    As further proof, take a look and listen to actual Africans: they “dance” by jumping up and down in place, and their “music” is monotonous drumming, rather like the rhythmic banality of today’s “rap”.

  148. @momsaid

    “Would the virtue signalers please decide which races they think are superior or incompetent, and stick to their story? It would make it easier for us reasonable people who just happen to have played in the orchestra with Black classmates…and did just fine!”

    There you go with your White Male logic, raping these fine people just like Beethoven does.

    You’re assuming they’re honest people trying to figure out the truth. They are not. They are playing a game, pretending to be “scholars” but actually mouthing whatever they think will up their social credit school. Inconsistency, or even outright idiocy, is irrelevant.

    The philosopher Bernard Williams once responded to the argument for socialized medicine that “the goal of medical care is health, not making money” by suggesting we recognize a new category of action. “schmoctoring,” which looks just like doctoring but is actually engaged in to make a living.

    These people are social schmoctoring.

  149. Solitary says:

    Inquiring minds want to know:. Why are all these woke folks against systemic white racism speaking English, the language fo the oppressor? Just asking….

    • Replies: @tolstoy
  150. Neuday says:
    @G J T

    Hey! We DO have something in common!

    The vast majority of blacks do not even have ideological considerations. They are a victim of their own genetic predispositions and susceptibility to manipulation by hostile forces (i.e. Jews).

    The vast majority of whites do not even have ideological considerations. They are a victim of their own genetic predispositions [altruism, high-trust] and susceptibility to manipulation by hostile forces (i.e. Jews).

    Or, perhaps:

    The vast majority of white women do not even have ideological considerations. They are a victim of their own genetic predispositions and susceptibility to manipulation by hostile forces (i.e. Jews).

  151. @gotmituns

    Jeez, even Alex knew it was “lovely Ludwig van.”

    Bad Alex:

    Dr. Brodsky: Sin? What’s all this about sin?
    Alex: That! Using Ludwig van like that! He did no harm to anyone. Beethoven just wrote music!
    Dr. Brodsky: Are you referring to the background score?

    Good (Woke) Alex:

    Alex: I woke up. The pain and sickness all over me like an animal. Then I realized what it was. The music coming up from the floor was our old friend, Ludwig Van, and the dreaded Ninth Symphony.

  152. @phillip sawicki

    I tend to agree with Colin Wilson (Brandy of the Damned aka Chords and Discords) that Beethoven though in some sense “great” lacks the ease and facility we find in the truly great, like Mozart. Beethoven simply seems to be trying too hard. I suppose this is what the author above lauds as his “Faustian” or “Promethean” striving etc. But as Wilson says, he too often sounds like he’s pounding on the table, demanding to be appreciated.

  153. Trinity says:
    @Schuetze

    Good to know that Jews are such warriors, maybe now they can start fighting wars on their own and America, Germany and other White nations can kick Israel to the curb and off their welfare lists. Seventy-two years is long enough to be in the nest, time for Israel to fly on its own. As I said before, the negro, the Jew, and others OWE WHITES BILLIONS OF DOLLARS FOR REPARATIONS IF NOT TRILLIONS. ALL NONWHITES are burdens to Whites while living in OUR nations. WE don’t need them in the least. Jews, the negro, and other nonwhites should pay reparations to live in White nations.

    • Replies: @GeneralRipper
  154. MayRay says:

    Ewell and Rogers are both mulattos which means they are part black and part something else…most probably part white, thus their critique of Beethoven is irrelevant because they are not blacks or Africans.
    More white slaves were for sale in the Jewish run slave markets that sold their slaves to the Muslim rulers of North Africa and the Middle East, than ever there were black slaves in the USA.
    Most of the slave markets in the USA were run by Jews and all the slave ships that carried the slaves from Africa to the Americas were owned by Jews.
    There is documentary evidence to support everyone of these statements.
    Quite clearly the complaints of mulattos and Jews are just sour grapes. The mulattos because they self-hate their mixed blood and the Jews because they lost their excessive profits from the most profitable business enterprise ever devised: slavery.
    Only people without morals deal in slaves and work slaves.
    Beethoven was not a slaver nor had slaves working for him. Thus to be criticised by Jews is ridiculous and to be put down by mulattos is just silly.
    Hate never justifies anything.

  155. raga10 says:
    @James O'Meara

    An argument could be made for the equality or superiority of the Hindu or Chinese traditions

    Indeed. Personally I could never get into Chinese… well – anything… but Europeans have nothing on Indian classical music! Their music theory is well formalized and exceedingly complex. Whether that equals “quality” is debatable and ultimately subjective, but Indian classical music is certainly not primitive.

  156. Anon[573] • Disclaimer says:

    This is an excellent article on my most beloved composer. I’m familiar with the idea of some that Beethoven was black, which I have never seen any evidence to prove. He did have a close friend who was a famous violinist who had a white father and black mother. Beethoven in fact wrote and named a sonata for him only to change the name later when they were rivals for the same woman. The one thing I disagree with in this article is near the end where the writer says the Moors were not ethically black. That’s true of the first two Moorish invasions. The third invasion was most definitely black from the area of northwestern Africa. Last of all, if none of the Moors were black why did Shakespear and others use the term “Blackamoor” to describe any of them? And why are pictures of black Moors found across Europe and in many genealogical trees? In the last two cases the faces shown are not Arab, but black. Vive le Ninth Symphony!!!

  157. My biological parents were of the white race Must I denounce them as well?
    This is all very reminiscent of the Stalinist art criticism.

  158. @Schuetze

    So we have two scientists, some Bolshevik murderers and one assassin.

    Bravo!

    Great Jewish War Heroes can probably be counted on one hand…lol

    Compare and contrast.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Irish-American_Medal_of_Honor_recipients

    Of the 3,464 Medals of Honor awarded as of September 17, 2009, an estimated 2,021 have been awarded to Irish-American recipients, more than twice the number awarded any other ethnic group.

  159. @Trinity

    Good to know that Jews are such warriors, maybe now they can start fighting wars on their own and America, Germany and other White nations can kick Israel to the curb and off their welfare lists.

    What happened the last time they ventured into Gaza, with all the tech, intel and American support available to them?

    Jews are the world’s premiere “marketers”. Most things Jewish are vastly overrated, that most especially includes their military.

  160. Trinity says:

    Kang George was a black man,yo and you know damn well that Shakespeare was a brother, yo. Beethoven had to be a black man, yo. We wuz kangz and sheeit, yo.

  161. [MORE]

    https://www.amren.com/news/2015/06/are-white-men-gods-ii-getting-the-facts-straight/

    Turd World Bug People and Greedy Chinks only TRY to duplicate greatness, they never create it.

    Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

    • Agree: Kolya Krassotkin
  162. JimB says:

    A precis of Phillip Ewell’s academic output:

  163. @Schuetze

    That was funny. Wow, what an honor to be compared to The Donald. 😉

    Naw, I was just a good kid. I was lucky, too. A lot of kids never get the opportunities or breaks I got.

    Never had kids myself. Had a vasectomy at 21 (yes, 21). My folks wanted to kill me for that. I just couldn’t bring kids into a world I felt was inevitably headed towards utter dystopia, based on what I saw all around me at the time. Seems I was right, very sad to say.

    Despite that, I’ve raised two sets of other women’s kids, though. One set (son and daughter) in the USA in the 80s and 90s, and the second (a daughter) from 2005 onward, initially in the US, then in NZ for the critical years. All are well adjusted, happy, successful kids, thankfully. Probably more in spite of me than because of me.

    Back in the USA now. Sad to see what’s going on here, but not sure I’d be happier in back in NZ. We still own a home there, but our daughter (who was living there while attending college) just finished her degree in electrical engineering at Victoria University and took a job at Stanford as a research assistant, so she, like her mother and I, are all back in the belly of the beast, for better or worse.

    Cheers!

    MM

    • Replies: @Schuetze
  164. This is a dumb article. Sniping at Jews over classical music when Jews seem to provide the majority of the philanthropic funding for classical performances. Non-Jewish white billionaires tend to obsess over black people giving each other brain damage in sportsball instead.

    • Troll: GeneralRipper
    • Replies: @La Regenta
    , @HeebHunter
  165. tolstoy says:

    If you look at the youngsters taking up classical music, they are all Asians. They appreciate classical music, knowing that this discipline raises their children IQ even more. I don’t see any green, bile-like envy there. They genuinely love the classical composers. In a hundred years, there won’t be any white classical musicians left.
    One simple solution to the racial problem and the maintenance of white culture, already happening, is the merging of White and Asians. You can’t hardly walk around Southern California without seeing mixed couples and their children. This master race will be invincible to the Jews, who are inherently inbred, and the African and Latinos, who are basically left behind, excluded.
    I think the white, who seeks some semblance of truth, will eventually migrate to Asia, where the truth, such science, philosophy, music, etc, is maintained. The white, who stays behind, will completely convert into a self-loathing bunch. Two best examples are Jim Roger to Singapore, and Marc Faber to Thailand, two very successful investors.

    Such is my rambling.

    • Replies: @Malla
  166. And the newest fan who will in turn turn people on to Beethoven….well without further ado

  167. @raga10

    “Whether that equals “quality” is debatable and ultimately subjective, but Indian classical music is certainly not primitive.”

    I have a nice collection of classical Indian music on the “Nimbus” sub label of Chandos records that I bought long, long ago. Much of it is mesmerizing and deeply spiritual stuff, at least that was how it made me feel when I listened to them. Evening Ragas were especially hypnotic and supremely relaxing. My then wife was likewise smitten. We listened to them together often. Really lovely.

    Here is an example of a favorite of ours, Rag Lalit: https://www.chandos.net/products/catalogue/NI%205152

    Cheers!

    MM

    • Replies: @James O'Meara
  168. tolstoy says:
    @Solitary

    You never heard of Ebonics, quite an enlightening linguistic achievement, so I’ve been told.

  169. anon[175] • Disclaimer says:

    The only actual evidence of any degree of Negro blood in Beethoven is that he is reputed to have been a very bad tenant, pouring water over his head and onto the floor, stomping around all hours of the night pounding on the piano and screaming. The only black thing he neglected to do was open all the windows and turn the thermostat up to ninety degrees.

    • Replies: @James O'Meara
  170. baythoven says:
    @phillip sawicki

    Beethoven was considered the “greatest” composer of all time a century ago. But the invention of the CD has made the works of many other composers available that once were unknown. Nobody with any knowledge of classical music talks that way any more.

    Personally, I am certain that Beethoven is the greatest composer of all time, and I am sure that many other highly knowledgeable and talented musicians feel the same way. The only thing I will grant you is that it’s not a typical line of discussion among mature adults. (“Beethoven’s the greatest.” “No, Mozart’s the greatest.” etc. Not much point in that.)

    • Replies: @Sparkon
  171. Alden says:
    @Sparkon

    I am considerate enough to not post comments in French but in English. If you want to be rude and post comments in foreign languages go right ahead.

    • Replies: @Truth
  172. @Not Only Wrathful

    While Jews are leading donors to orchestras they are also in the vanguard of attacks on “whiteness” and the pillars of Western Civilization. Do you deny this?

    • Agree: GeneralRipper
  173. LeoB says:

    “…influential French writer Romain Rolland holding the composer up as a role model…”

    really? out of all people you had to pick Romain Rolland? i don’t think his praise is that important – to say the least.

  174. No matter how many times I listened to one of Beethoven’s works, it never bored me.

    Once you start playing his work on the piano [in my case], you finally/fully realize why the music never bores. He was a master of variations, for a very good reason…

    Here’s a reenactment of a improvisation ‘duel’ between Steibelt and Beethoven @

  175. @raga10

    Well, I mentioned Chinese to be open minded and because those are the three main systems, but the Chinese really is a mess. 5 notes is simply not enough to do anything with, which is why their music sounds like the same notes up and down, over and over… because it is.

    This could be why Asians really take to Western classical (or pop) music, the Indians not so much, even with British domination for decades.

    They do have excellent cuisine traditions, though (apart from the dog and bat elements). Iron Chef had it about right: Chinese, Japanese, French; and Italian from time to time.

    • Replies: @Badger Down
  176. @Mustapha Mond

    Nimbus is an underappreciated source for Indian classical music. I once had their multi-cd set where they simply recorded the ragas themselves, in order, for ones education.

    I once heard some modern Indian on the radio (well, I guess he’d have to modern, then), I guess a film composer, who said “The Indian film industry has had to incorporate Western music in its scores, because otherwise you can’t express emotion.” I nearly punched him through the radio.

    • Replies: @Malla
    , @Malla
  177. Truth says:
    @James Scott

    Classical music outsells all other types of music combined so it is better.

    Well now, that’s news:

    ://www.statista.com/statistics/310746/share-music-album-sales-us-genre/

  178. Truth says:
    @Alden

    Malheureusment, Aldey, la chevalerie et mort.

    • Replies: @Rahan
  179. anon[384] • Disclaimer says:
    @phillip sawicki

    “Beethoven was considered the ‘greatest’ composer of all time a century ago. . . Nobody with any knowledge of classical music talks that way any more.”

    One of the reasons Beethoven was considered “the ‘greatest’ composer of all time a century ago” is that is what the greatest composers and musicians of the 19th and 20th centuries considered him to be. He certainly wrote much of the greatest music of all time. And he certainly wrote the greatest music ever written by a deaf guy. Beethoven was fully aware of his greatness, but he also was aware of others. He thought, for example, that Schubert “might even surpass me.”

    There probably will never be one “greatest composer of all time,” any more than there can be one “most beautiful woman of all time.” Beethoven, however, will always be a prime candidate for at least one of those titles.

  180. V. Hickel says:
    @RoatanBill

    sailer had an item a while back in a similar vein. some idiot talking about she cant understand the appeal of that pale, bland dry white meat chicken, when everybody knows deep down, that dem dark thighs is where all the juicy flava be at.

    • Replies: @RoatanBill
  181. “long been an argument of white supremacists, Nazis, Neo-Nazis, and racial separatists …”
    Who knows? That might be correct. I must admit, I spend very little time reading the works of “white supremacists, Nazis, Neo-Nazis, and racial separatists”, and I don’t know anybody who does. Perhaps the author of that comment reads a lot of it, and therefore knows more about them than the rest of us do.

  182. Trinity says:

    IF America was about 87-88% White as late as the mid to late 1960s then who do you think built America? Was Tesla, Edison, Marconi, Ford, Wright Brothers all Jews or negroes? Some Chinaman invent television? ROTFLMMFWAO.

    We wuz kangz, yawl. They took us from Wakanda and sheeit, yo.

    • Replies: @James O'Meara
  183. “We Write Symphonies”

    We are the fastest and the greatest community. There is nothing like our community of nations. The world has never known anything like our community of nations.
    We write symphonies. We pursue innovation. We celebrate our ancient heroes, embrace our timeless traditions and customs, and always seek to explore and discover brand-new frontiers.

    We reward brilliance. We strive for excellence, and cherish inspiring works of art that honor God. We treasure the rule of law and protect the right to free speech and free expression.

    We empower women as pillars of our society and of our success. We put faith and family, not government and bureaucracy, at the center of our lives. And we debate everything. We challenge everything. We seek to know everything so that we can better know ourselves.
    And above all, we value the dignity of every human life, protect the rights of every person, and share the hope of every soul to live in freedom. That is who we are. Those are the priceless ties that bind us together as nations, as allies, and as a civilization.
    What we have, what we inherited from our — and you know this better than anybody, and you see it today with this incredible group of people — what we’ve inherited from our ancestors has never existed to this extent before. And if we fail to preserve it, it will never, ever exist again. So we cannot fail.

    This great community of nations has something else in common: In every one of them, it is the people, not the powerful, who have always formed the foundation of freedom and the cornerstone of our defense. The people have been that foundation here in Poland — as they were right here in Warsaw — and they were the foundation from the very, very beginning in America.
    Our citizens did not win freedom together, did not survive horrors together, did not face down evil together, only to lose our freedom to a lack of pride and confidence in our values. We did not and we will not.
    We will never back down.

    As long as we know our history, we will know how to build our future.

    –Donald J. Trump 2017

  184. @HeebHunter

    but our gifted child doesn’t RANT IN UPPERCASE ….so he wins an honorable mention

    he claims to play the flute. . . maybe someone can send him some leotards and a feather ♫ ♪

  185. Sparkon says:
    @baythoven

    Personally, I am certain that Beethoven is the greatest composer of all time, and I am sure that many other highly knowledgeable and talented musicians feel the same way. The only thing I will grant you is that it’s not a typical line of discussion among mature adults. (“Beethoven’s the greatest.” “No, Mozart’s the greatest.” etc. Not much point in that.)

    Well, I think you’re trying to have it both ways, first blowing your horn for Beethoven, then saying we shouldn’t do that, so you’ve set up a nice double-standard.

    Sure, it’s safe to get into the Beethoven or Mozart camps because hive minds think alike, but when it comes to music, I tend to think with my ears, and my ears tell me Haydn is much better than either, writing by himself more than twice as many symphonies as did Beethoven and Mozart combined, so it’s really a shame that Haydn has been somewhat shoved aside by these lesser talents.

    I find Beethoven’s symphonies too heavy, too dark, and too loud, where Haydn is joyous, rhythmic, upbeat, sometimes delicate, sometimes fiery, weaving themes and melodies that appeal to my emotions in a way few other composers can, although I do have other favorites.

    Anyway, I’ve been delighted just now to discover some new recordings on YouTube by Italian conductor Giovanni Antonini performing Haydn with his orchestra Il Giardino Armonico, or IGA, and these guys are good! Here’s Haydn’s No. 22, “The Philosopher,” performed in Esterhazy Palace in 2014:

    Haydn – Symphony No. 22 E flat major “Il filosofo” (Il Giardino Armonico, Giovanni Antonini)

    • Replies: @baythoven
  186. Only Blacks can create music, so either Beethoven was really Black or else he stole everything from Blacks.

  187. AceDeuce says:

    Regarding the fanciful claims of kneegrows that Beethoven and other White geniuses were actually black–may I point out that black homosexual Malcolm X asserted (with no proof given) to his biographer, black homosexual Alex Haley that Mr. Genocide himself, Christopher Columbus, was also black. This of course was when Columbus was regarded as a hero.

  188. @Trinity

    Well, that’s a piss-poor argument. A small number of people could be responsible for massive amounts of influence. Actually, that’s what your citing of Tesla, Edison, etc. shows. I guess Edison didn’t contribute squat, being one guy and all, versus all those millions of hillbillies. Ford built cars by hand, didn’t need any of those negroes from down South.

    Also, 40% of your examples are… immigrants.

    Some stereotypes are true: conservatives are dumb.

    • Troll: Trinity
    • Replies: @Trinity
  189. baythoven says:
    @Sparkon

    Well, I think you’re trying to have it both ways, first blowing your horn for Beethoven, then saying we shouldn’t do that, so you’ve set up a nice double-standard.

    Please read my comment in the context of replying to a previous commenter — the latter part of my comment a response to his “Nobody with any knowledge of classical music talks that way any more.”

    I’m a big Haydn fan, actually. I assume you are the same Haydn enthusiast I concurred with some months ago on this site. Particularly because Haydn is widely underrated, it’s good you comment as you do.

    I find Beethoven’s symphonies too heavy, too dark, and too loud, where Haydn is joyous, rhythmic, upbeat, sometimes delicate, sometimes fiery…

    All those adjectives you ascribe to Haydn are also descriptive of Beethoven. Beethoven encompasses every aspect of the human spirit, though to fully appreciate this one probably needs to explore beyond the symphonies — The piano sonatas prove it all, but then why stop there? Add in the violin and cello sonatas, the quartets and piano trios. Most sublime of all is his Missa Solemnis.

    Of course, Haydn is more than his symphonies too. I love his string quartets and his masses. Good song writer, too.

    • Replies: @Swan knight
  190. Malla says:
    @omegabooks

    They’ve pretty much wiped out rock music anyway

    I was reading somewhere a long time back, do not remember which had a very interesting concept. Listen “Modern culture” which was pushed for a long time (Hence the German National Socialist’s fight against degenerate art) was pushed more thoroughly since the 1960s by the Satanic Cultural Marxist slimeballs. Their main aim was to destroy Traditional Western Culture (like the Victorian era culture) which they hated a lot. But they aimed to destroy all (positive elements of) traditional cultures around the World.
    Even John Lennon once said ‘Show business is a extension of the Jewish Religion’ which he later denied

    John Lennon ”Show business is a extension of the Jewish Religion”
    So not only was this Jewish “modern culture” attacking the traditional White World it was attacking all cultures around the World. That is because the final aim is One World Government under Zio control and Global Communist slavery to be imposed on all of us eventually.
    To create a break with traditions concepts like “generation gap” and dividing music by decades was put in place. So you have the 80s music, 90s music etc… which creates a constant break with the past. Also they researched human behaviour and tastes and realized there are people with different tendencies and hence various genres were pushed. For example disco music came because they realized that there were sections of the population to whose tastes and tendencies, the established genres did not cater to.
    But now comes the global picture. What they correctly found out was that, the so called White dominated music (lets call it White Music) of the earlier decades after the 60s did not appeal to the lower IQ masses of the Black Brown World. It appealed to Whites and Yellows even those living in Communist countries all the way through from top to bottom. But as far as Brown (maybe including Reds) and Black populations, this White music only appealed to the higher IQ educated section of the populations and not the masses. For example Rock music got sold on the Westernised high IQ elites of the brown world but not the masses. Why so? Many reasons. Average “White culture” is still high average IQ in nature as it has to appeal to the White masses and thus would appeal only to a subsection (right hand of the bell curve) of Brown/ Black populations. Also differences in tastes and tendencies. Modern White culture however revolutionary was still too “posh” for the Brown/Black masses.
    But ((they)) wanted to influence the Brown/Black masses. Destroy the positive (and even negative) elements of their popular cultures (which was more traditional as late as the 70s and 80s), push promiscuity/ homosexuality on them too. Hence there was a change of plan, they started pushing Black dominated culture (we shall call it Black Culture) around the 90s.
    Now Ghetto Black Culture due to IQ, taste and tendency reasons immediately hit a cord with the low IQ thuggish masses of the Brown Black World. Soon many local Rap like artists appeared in these countries in their own languages, Ghetto like clothing style became popular and with it entered promiscuity, cultural destruction etc… into Brown Black countries too. The media elites got that right.
    …TO BE CONTINUED….

    • Replies: @Malla
    , @Trinity
  191. Malla says:
    @Malla

    …CONTINUED…..
    India was a tough nut to crack as even Black culture which spread around the World, into the Middle East, South America etc… would not have any effect on insular Indians. In India’s case, Bollywood suddenly changed in the early 2000s and rap and black culture started seeping in. Indians living in the West like Honey Singh (were they programmed for this?) too started introducing rap crap into the Indian population. Added to that Bollywood reached the entire Indian population from high IQ to lowest IQ, from city dwellers to villagers. And since the early 2000s, I see (as can anyone) the massive increase in promiscuity, cultural destruction and even divorces are going through the roof in India now. Even in small towns.
    One more thing.
    Cultural Marxism actually ended up screwing up Blacks the most. They faced the most cultural destruction (baby mammas, kids born out of wedlock) etc… See, after WW2, the ((elites)) realized that using White Working classes to have a Globalist Communist revolution was impossible and hence they started using darkis a lot and the White Working Class was eventually unceremoniously ditched by the left. Thus the attack on traditional White culture and Cultural Maxism. Churches were infiltrated to a larger degree with Globalist Communists etc.. Ghetto Black Americans are screwed up socially. No good social values, idiots behave like super consumerists, do not save money, slavishly buy the latest Capitalist created sneakers, will even kill people for these consumerist corporate manufactured crap. Thanks to Cultural Marxism!! That is why I say, Marxism and Corporatism strangely go hand in hand.
    But the aim is to bring the White Working Class and even the White Middle Class to the level of the Ghetto. Hence the spread of ghetto rap, twerking, suddenly we have White rappers. Soon Ghetto music and mindsets permeate into the White Working and Middle Classes and eventually they go down to the level of the ghetto where most blacks already are.
    White Culture like Rock have done their work, they are are not needed anymore for now. It is Rap now.
    Classical Music–>Jazz—>Rock & Roll—>Rap—> Jungle Commie music. Wow, whata fall!!! Fall of civilization.
    The only thing is, Jews too have taken their own poison.

  192. Malla says:
    @tolstoy

    It is very interesting how East Asians, among all the races, appreciate traditional high culture of Europe and the West. Maybe because of similar high average IQ and high taste. Even if many Chinese and Koreans hate the West, they appreciate high YT traditional culture more than other races. These Northern Mongoloids appreciate White Caucasoid culture far more than Darker Southern Caucasoids like Middle Easterners and South Asians. In India, European Classical Music is the preserve of Parsis. Non-Parsis are rarely into European Classical Music.
    Tropical/Southern Brown people (both the Caucasoid and Mongoloid variety), and I am one of them, are just truly diluted niggers. Capice.

  193. @V. Hickel

    flava be at
    Thanks for the grin.

    The US is one large nut house. The only virus running around must be one that turns most people into blithering leftists.

    The rest of the planet must be wondering how a criminal, identified by his own son’s laptop evidence, suffering from obvious dementia, got voted in by millions of actual votes to become president. The cheating in the process, they probably expect from that shining beacon on the hill.

  194. Schuetze says:
    @Mustapha Mond

    This is just about my favoring painting of all time. That is likely me in the third row center. I imagine you were in the front row. Except for some math and science classes, I never got a 4.0, I just never had the memory or the patience.

    Are you Turkish?

    • Replies: @Badger Down
  195. @Sparkon

    Haydn was Beethoven’s teacher and Mozart’s mentor. Haydn was every bit that great

  196. Malla says:
    @James O'Meara

    The Indian film industry has had to incorporate Western music

    South Indian (Carnatic) Music has been highly influenced by Western Classical Music as well as British sea shanties during colonial times. British and French colonial officers would frequent the places of Indian Classical Music masters. The British Raj even opened institutions to preserve and develop Indian Classical Music such as Morris College.

  197. Trinity says:
    @James O'Meara

    They were all WHITE. What did your (((kind))) ever create, Shlomo. Your kind is the King of Parasites, even more so than the lowly negro. Hell, your kind and your beloved Israel could not even beat a bunch of primitive A-rabs if not for America and other Western nations having to fight your battles for you. Better to be a dumb hillbilly than a sexually degenerate inbred Jew. That’s right, Jews self project their habit of inbreeding on rural White folk, the Jew is notorious for inbreeding, same as the Arab, the Black race, mixed race Hispanics, LMAO. Cue: Dueling Banjos from the movie, “Deliverance” with Jews in small hats doing a jig around chickens.

  198. profnasty says:

    sotto voce.
    Jimi certainly had no exposure to classical music. But his two long solos; Hear My T Comin’, from Rainbow Bridge record; and Red House, from Loose Ends record; to me, show a talent which approaches classical standards. I always thought of those solos as being creative uber alles.
    Sorry for the digression, and for the bad grammar, and for the unfunny humor.
    Peace.

  199. Trinity says:
    @Malla

    Jews attack and wish to destroy other cultures because the Jew has no culture of his own. The Jew is a vagabond, a glorified gypsy, who has no true home to call his own. People who feel dead inside like the Jew can only feel joy by destroying things, they are soulless, and can only feel alive by destroying others and their culture. The Jew is empty inside. The same could be said with the Black race as well. The Black race has only contributed to America in sports and entertainment. I have worked alongside many Blacks over the years and watched them keep up a job year after year despite taking 30-40 minute breaks and excessively long lunch breaks. I have watched them go to the time clock punch in after their 30 minute lunch break and then sit down for another 30+ minutes riding the clock without any repercussions. My guess is the Black race was even lazy during times of slavery, they are a lazy lot for the most part. I can count how many hardworking Blacks I have seen on one hand in my lifetime. I have watched a Black man fall asleep standing up on an assembly line, how in the hell does one fall asleep standing up?

    The Jew has no culture to speak of, and the Black man has only his music. Even the sports that the Black man excels in were all invented by the White man. The Black man’s “soul food?” Nothing more than culture appropriation from White Southerners. All that jive about collard greens and/or turnip greens and neck bones, pinto beans flavored with ham hocks and cornbread, etc., being “soul food” is bullshit. Southern Blacks stole that way of cooking from White Southerners.

    • Agree: Malla
    • Replies: @Malla
    , @notoneofthem
    , @Truth
  200. Bach, Haydn, Beethoven, Mozart, and Wagner rank among the greatest and most accomplished geniuses of all time. No non-White European equivalent exists. Charlie Parker, Louis Armstrong, Duke Ellington, and Count Basie were greats yet so were Glenn Miller, Harry James, Benny Goodman, and the Dorsey Brothers. Ella Fitzgerald was a national treasure yet Jo Stafford could also sing the birds out of the trees. Chuck Berry, Little Richard Penneman, and Fats Antoine Domino had Elvis Aaron Presley, Buddy Holly, and Jerry Lee Lewis. The rich MOTOWN sound of Barry Gordy and Philly International of Gamble and Huff had to compete with the British Invasion and the Beach Boys. John Coltrane could surely play as could Stan Getz. Jimmie Hendrix may have been the greatest yet Eddie Van Halen gave him a run for his money. Cultural Marxism emanates from the Jewish Frankfort School. Mendelsohn, Copland, and Bernstein not withstanding, Jews have mostly acted to undermine Western Civilization and Culture, not contribute to it. Since they have no Beethoven they must diminish and cancel him. What do the Jews do about Gustav Mahler? He was born Jewish yet converted to Christianity. In closing, despite all of the advancements in electric guitars, keyboard synthesizers, and computer technology, Wagner’s Ring Cycle, composed in the mid 19th century and utilizing acoustic instruments, is the most futuristic music in existence

    • Replies: @Dr. Charles Fhandrich
  201. @baythoven

    Haydn was Beethoven’s teacher. Haydn taught him well. Haydn advanced Baroque music into the classical era. I rank Haydn as History’s fifth greatest composer behind only Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, and Wagner

    • Replies: @baythoven
  202. Malla says:
    @Trinity

    The Jew has no culture to speak of,

    They copy everything form the people around them and give them a weird Jewish twist. How Yiddish came from German. Even Israeli food is ripped off from Arab cuisine around them like Falafels.

  203. Malla says:
    @James O'Meara

    The Indian film industry has had to incorporate Western music in its scores,

    Bollywood has a long history of shamelessly copying Western music and passing it as its own and fooling the Indian masses about their “musical genius”. They also copy K-pop Korean music. Only now in these days of youtube many Indians are waking up to their extensive copying of Western and East Asian tunes. Also Middle Eastern songs.

    American western folk ballad “OH MY DARLING CLEMENTINE” tune copied into 1956 popular classic Bollywood song “YEH HAI BOMBAY MERI JAAN”.

    BOLLYWOOD SONGS COPIED FROM KPOP!

    Copied Song tunes in Bollywood from English songs and other songs

  204. baythoven says:
    @Swan knight

    I’m with you, though I’d add Handel and Brahms into the mix.

  205. @Swan knight

    Interesting comment about Wagner’s Ring Cycle. There was talk around 20 or so years ago, that someone had planned a Wagner concert at the Grand Canyon, Arizona. I would have cancelled everything to attend that!!

  206. Sidney says:
    @Tom

    Your post is a must read concerning the take-down of whites and their achievements by the usual suspects.
    I like what Hitler said about modern art:
    “works of art which cannot be understood in themselves but need some pretentious instruction book to justify their existence will never again find their way to the German people”. This so vilified man quite often saw things in common sense terms.

    • Replies: @raga10
  207. raga10 says:
    @Sidney

    I like what Hitler said about modern art:
    “works of art which cannot be understood in themselves but need some pretentious instruction book to justify their existence will never again find their way to the German people”.

    Well, wherever he is he must be smiling looking at the world today, because he’s got his wish. Sure: wankery of “high” art still exists on the fringes, but it is rendered completely irrelevant because virtually nobody gives a damn. What the public at large consume is mostly rap, hip-hop and reality tv, all of which represent the absolute lowest common denominator.

    … What? Aren’t you happy with how it all turned out?

    • Replies: @Malla
  208. @Schuetze

    That’s me at the back, fast asleep.
    I wouldn’t know a 4.0 if it jumped up and bit me.

    • LOL: Bardon Kaldian
  209. @James O'Meara

    Chinese music has more than “five notes”.
    It has at least twelve, each of which can be bent or stretched.

  210. @Not Only Wrathful

    The only reason the kikes are doing that is so they can pull a Wakanda on authentic European cultures. Same “fellow white” crap they have been doing for centuries.

  211. Malla says:
    @raga10

    Hitler would have criticized ghetto rap too. They were criticizing Jazz way back then. National Socialism was about elevating the Working classes to a higher level of culture and thought. German workers were given tickets to high Opera. Zio Cultural marxism “modern culture” is about promoting lower barbaric culture by slow doses with time and bring the Middle Classes and Working classes to a low level of savagery and idiocracy. So that they can be controlled easily and never be true threat to the elites. They want the whole world to go ghetto with destroyed families, no savings and idiots fighting each other over some overpriced “cool” plastic crap built by corporations using slave labour somewhere. Ghetto youfs be fightin (& at times killin) for da latest Nike’s and sheet. That is what they want the Whole World to become.

    • Replies: @Truth
  212. @Trinity

    If you had to list an area where the Jew has contributed to culture in America, it would definately be
    in comedy. Entertainment.
    Blacks great contribution has been in music. The U.S. unquestionably was the leader in music throughout the 20th century with every other country being an imitator of American music.
    The great Black contribution to music was really in Rock, wich had it’s foundation in Blues.
    Rap was just an offshoot of Rock.
    Jews were the leaders in comedy. The Three Stooges were the foundation then you had Mel Brooks,
    Zucker Brothers, slapstick comedy. More recently great comics like Larry David, Ben Stiller.

    The great Irish-American comedian George Carlin once said something along the lines that Whites should not be allowed to play or sing the Blues. That was their thing and it got pretty sickening all these white artists pretending to be Black.

    Everybody raves about how great Hendrix was, theres another one word title “Hendrix”.

    But then you had Clapton, Jimi Page, Jeff Beck, Ritchie Blackmore, then an entire generation of truly great White Rock musicians.

    Many preffered the understated, less-is-more, approach of a Clapton, “Slowhand”.

    Heavy Metal was an almost totally White genre that returned to an almost neo-classicalism.

    We all have our “things”, people should be allowed to be who they are and not try to be somebody else.

    • Replies: @Truth
    , @Trinity
  213. Truth says:
    @Trinity

    I have worked alongside many Blacks over the years and watched them keep up a job year after year despite taking 30-40 minute breaks and excessively long lunch breaks. I have watched them go to the time clock punch in after their 30 minute lunch break and then sit down for another 30+ minutes riding the clock without any repercussions.

    Oh, I don’t know, U-T. If you had to punch a time clock, or wear a name badge past the age of 40, you probably had grand career issues of your own.

    • Replies: @Trinity
  214. Truth says:
    @Malla

    Ghetto youfs be fightin (& at times killin) for da latest Nike’s and sheet. That is what they want the Whole World to become.

    What do you mean “become?”


    [MORE]

    • Troll: GeneralRipper
  215. Truth says:
    @notoneofthem

    Jews were the leaders in comedy. The Three Stooges were the foundation then you had Mel Brooks,
    Zucker Brothers, slapstick comedy. More recently great comics like Larry David, Ben Stiller.

    If they did not own the industry and every medium of distribution, would we think these people were funny? Maybe if some hicks from Tennessee owned Hollywood, our idea of “comedy” would be different. Maybe white people from Idaho would actually find white people from Idaho funny rather than Khazars from Manhattan, do you think?

    Is it possible that you find the people you mentioned above funny because your overseers have defined strict boundaries as to what “funny” can be at what it cannot, as everybody you mentioned above was probably raised within a 5 square-mile area, with the exception of Stiller, who’s father was?

    Don’t quote me on this, but maybe if this were not the case, white people would find people with a common look and upbringing funny, as black people do.

  216. Trinity says:
    @notoneofthem

    Duane Allman, Stevie Ray Vaughn, Eddie Van Halen, and Mick Taylor were all better guitarist than Hendrix. Hendrix was great but these guys were better, and as great as Hendrix was, he was overrated because he was a Black man playing rock and roll music so the Jew music industry had to make him even more special than he truly was. Ernie Isley, Hendrix started with the Isley brothers was a great guitarist and so was Prince btw. “Jews and comedy?” The only Jew comedians that I enjoyed was/were Rodney Dangerfield and Steven Wright. I truly found Dangerfield to be funny and I like Wright’s unique style of comedy, ( I think Wright is Jewish, he sure looks it.) Most Jew comedians I find to be seriously not funny in the least. I was say that Black comedians are far funnier than Jew comedians and IMO even funnier than many White comedians. I never found Carlin to be funny to be honest. Might surprise people that I enjoy Black comedians and Black soul, and R& B music. Dave Chappelle is great. His Black White Supremacist skit with Clayton Bigsby had me pissing my pants and “The Nigger Family” was hysterical. Lavell Crawford has me shitting my pants from laughing when I hear him. Matter of fact, I prefer Black comedians over White comedians most of the time.

  217. Trinity says:
    @Truth

    Proud to be a blue collar worker that actually produces things my man. My guess is you couldn’t last in a factory where temps were above 90 degrees and work a 12 hours shifts for seven days a week for months at a time. My guess is that I am just as smart IF not smarter than most people with collage degrees and I damn sure have more common sense. Peep this, nicca, I can do my own oil, change my own spark plugs, and change a tire, while most of your peeps from collage can’t even change a flat tire. And peep this playa, I betz I gotz mo’ money saved than all “tree” of yo commie nigra friends put together.

    Btw, I asked a collage edjumucated maroon with a degree just the other day, who wrote the National Anthem? And then I asked them when was it written? No answer for either question.

    • Replies: @Truth
    , @GeneralRipper
  218. Rahan says:
    @Truth

    Aldey aime harceler. Nous acceptons avec bonne humeur. C’est un endroit sûr pour tous ceux qui veulent se débarrasser du lavage de cerveau et cesser d’être “déclenché” vingt fois par jour. Il peut être un processus difficile 😀

    Online translate can be great wholesome fun!

    • LOL: Truth
  219. Truth says:
    @Trinity

    I can do my own oil, change my own spark plugs, and change a tire,

    That’s really impressive, Bro. I’m thinking Stanford should invite you into their Mechanical Engineering program.

    • Replies: @Trinity
  220. Trinity says:
    @Truth

    Tell da troof, Troof, you have less than 6 figures saved up and probably not much more than 5 figures in the bank. Tell it, Troof. I could wipe my ass with what you have saved up.

    Tell da troof, Troof, you are too lazy to wipe your ass hence the stained drawers you wear. Pull your pants up, boy, you have a big shit stain for everyone to see and it ruins my appetite. Your lazy, dumb ass would take 30 minutes to change a flat tire and that is da troof.

  221. Truth says:

    Tell da troof, Troof, you are too lazy to wipe your ass hence the stained drawers you wear. Pull your pants up, boy, you have a big shit stain for everyone to see and it ruins my appetite. Your lazy, dumb ass would take 30 minutes to change a flat tire and that is da troof.

    U-T, you have just taught me something extremely valuable; a few posts earlier I wrote this:

    Maybe if some hicks from Tennessee owned Hollywood, our idea of “comedy” would be different.

    Old Sport, you are about to witness a rare occurrence. The Truthster is going to admit he was wrong. Your sense of humor makes me appreciate all those Khazars from Brooklyn. Thank God the Jews handle comedy and not you folk.

  222. Truth says:

    LMAO!

    Just messin’ with you bud. Have a nice day.

  223. Schuetze says:

    This is definitely not Beethoven, but quite beautiful none the less.

    “In May of 1970, at a San Francisco concert venue best known for reverberating with the sounds of the Grateful Dead and Jefferson Airplane, three masters of Indian classical music took the stage for a celebration of Indian ragas. The concert was recorded by another legend of the time: Owsley Stanley, the man who designed the Dead’s innovative sound system, as well as making what was reputed to be the best LSD of its day. That recording is now available as a live album, titled Bear’s Sonic Journals: That Which Colors the Mind.

    On that night, Indian sarod master Ali Akbar Khan was joined on stage by sitar player Indranil Bhattacharya and a 19-year-old percussionist named Zakir Hussain. “

    https://www.npr.org/2021/01/23/959394422/when-the-giants-of-indian-classical-music-collided-with-psychedelic-san-francisc

  224. @Trinity

    Sheeeit! Troof got hizself a government job, boy!

    Dat nigga “works” for the Federal Government…lol

    That’s all you need to know.

    Local, State and Federal government bureaucracies are OVERFLOWING with stupid niggers and various other “minorities”.

    Troof fancies himself a “smart” nigger, because unlike 95% of the rest of the North American Pavement Apes, he can axeshully string together two semi-coherent sentences without using the words “bitch” or motherfucker”.

  225. @Truth

    Well Troof, one of the many truly impressive facts about White Christian Civilization, is that despite the fact that war was very often a grim reality, it advanced and became the greatest in recorded history regardless.

    The same cannot be said of The Dark Continent or North America with the Siberians or Central America with the Heart Eaters etc…

    Your people would STILL be killing and eating each other ( and in many cases still are ) without OUR civilization.

    Face it, Rufus. The very best thing to ever happen to your retarded, benighted race, was being shipped off to Whiteyland…lol

    Cassius Clay, as well as other pampered monkeys said as much in their unguarded moments.

  226. Malla says:
    @Truth

    Not the first time, when we criticize something negative about ghetto blacks (not all blacks, not the educated lot), we get responses of WW1 and WW2. Idiotic comparison.

    • Replies: @Truth
  227. Truth says:
    @Malla

    You’re right.

    40 million people haven’t been murdered in Baltimore. It’s only a few hundred a year.

    • Replies: @Malla
  228. Malla says:
    @Truth

    Truth, you thinskinned and trigger happy, shooting in wrong directions. I was not talking about the “violent nature of blacks” here. I was talking about the fact that ghetto American blacks are mentally influenced to remain in a barbaric state by design by the elites. And they want Whites to join them wholesale in that state. They want us all in that state. That is what I meant. Instead of us all ending up in the ghetto, it would make better sense to lift American blacks out of the ghetto. That is what Hitler’s National Socialism is all about.

    Anyways comparing armed military warfare with violent crime is ridiculous unless you talk about warfare in between gangs. Comparing random black ghetto crime with WW2 is as ridiculous as comparing random armed white criminals with the Ashanti-Fante wars.
    There is also the difference in between violence within the same society and warfare in between societies. Japanese are in general law abiding people but put them in uniform and a gun and they would conquer a big chunk of the World for you. After WW2, those Japanese became salarymen. Same with law abiding Germans, Stalin joked that the law abiding German tanks would stop at red traffic lights in their invasion. Italians are good mafiasos but in general sucked in war. Expanding nice and easy in North Africa until they clashed with the British Army, soon they were running back to base. Soon the British Army was expanding nice and easy at the expense of the Italians until they clashed with the German Deutches Africakorps under Rommel. Now they Brits faced a tough adversary and were running back.

    • Agree: Miro23
    • Replies: @Truth
  229. Trinity says:

    IF the Troof’s own kind, his Wakanda bruthas would have sold his ancestors to the Arabs, the males would have been more than likely castrated. I commented on another thread that I was puzzled why so many Africans in America and elsewhere adopt Islam as their religion to stick it to Whitey, hell, they are sticking it to themselves and submitting to their Arab slave masters who were the all time kings of not only the African slave trade but slavery in general. Those primitive camel jockeys also enslaved plenty of Whites in their day. So any White that adopts Islam as his or her religion is another jackass.

    Troof be told, Troof, better do like Clay/Ali and thank God Almighty his ancestors came with the White man because IF not da Troof would be defecating on a dirt floor with baboons, warthogs, and other African critters and be swatting flies from his face. Hell, Africans left behind in Africa with their original African slave masters fared far worse treatment than those shipped to America, I would be willing to bet the house on that one. Blacks can be extremely cruel and barbaric even to each other. Just look at South Africa and the practice of “necklacing.” My gawd, what kind of animal would think of such a way to torture someone like that?

    The Middle Eastern stone age tribes like the Jew, and Arab and Africans are some of the cruelest people around when it comes to mistreatment of their fellow man. The Oriental isn’t far behind. What the Vietnamese and Japanese did to American POW was very inhumane. Alas, the White man has also exhibited this sort of demonic behavior to his fellow humans, what happened to the German POW and civilians during and after WWII is one of the greatest atrocities done to man, at least 2 million German women of all ages raped, some multiple times, some no more than little girls, German soldiers exposed to the weather and no shelter, starving, thirsty, while Americans guards and others ate 3 squares a day. The White man also raped plenty of Japanese and Vietnamese women during those wars as well. I imagine the Black man did his share of raping in Vietnam as well. Of course work camps for Jews is considered to be the greatest atrocity of all time. No one according to the eternal victim, the oppressive Jew, has ever suffered so much. Troof is that the American Indian is the only victim that suffered in the end from the White man coming to America, everyone else, from the African in America, to the parasitical Jew have reaped all kinds of benefits at the White man’s expense.

    • Replies: @Truth
  230. Truth says:
    @Malla

    Ghetto youfs be fightin (& at times killin) for da latest Nike’s and sheet. That is what they want the Whole World to become.

    I was not talking about the “violent nature of blacks” here. I was talking about the fact that ghetto American blacks are mentally influenced to remain in a barbaric state by design by the elites.

    As your mom said when you were 20 months old and you desperately wanted more pal payasam but you could not quite make yourself understood because your mind was an incomprehensible swirl of the English your Daddy spoke on the telephone for work, the Hindi you were hearing on the TV set that was playing 7 hours a day in your apartment, and the Malayalam your older brother Dasyah and Laksh used to bully you with;

    “Malla, use your words!”

    • Replies: @Malla
  231. Truth says:
    @Trinity

    IF the Troof’s own kind, his Wakanda bruthas would have sold his ancestors to the Arabs, the males would have been more than likely castrated.

    …God forbid. You think white women in America are bitchy and unhappy now…?

    • Replies: @Trinity
  232. Trinity says:
    @Truth

    The decent and normal White women, the ones who are not battling drug addiction, or emotional/mental illness or obesity, would feel great knowing that they wouldn’t have to worry about horny muh dik Black males pestering them 24/7. Even Hispanic and Oriental women are not spared from Black male muh dik. Worked with a hawt senorita and she managed the tool crib, horny Black guys would try hanging out there all day instead of doing their job. The senorita even confided in me that she hated these Black guys pestering her, poor girl wound up quitting her job because she didn’t feel safe around these predatory oversexed perverts. Sorry Troof, but don’t believe (((Madison Avenue))) or (((Hymiewood))) , most NORMAL non-Black women don’t like Black males at all. IF you only knew what that senorita told me. lololol.

    • Agree: GeneralRipper
    • Replies: @Truth
  233. Truth says:
    @Trinity

    Oh, I don’t know, U-T. Things might not be that simple…

    • Replies: @Trinity
  234. Trinity says:
    @Truth

    ROTFLMMFWAO. Hell, Jewtube would take down a video if some Oriental chick was saying how she really viewed Black males. And they damn sure wouldn’t put up a video of what that senorita told me. hehe. Adios amigo. Those Korean chicks just wanted some click$ from delusional Black dudes with Yellow Fever. Good gawd, you are thick, breh. You can tell those two chicks are ACTING. You been played, SUCKA.

    “passionate about his work?” That leaves out every single Black male in the world. LMAO.

  235. Malla says:
    @Truth

    Again, you do not understand, that is exactly what I meant. Ghetto blacks are kept in a lower state by design where they are so crazy about some trinket created by corporations that they are ready to kill for such bullshit. And they want the whole world to become such a ghetto. A mental ghetto.
    There is a difference in between fighting for nation or ideology and fighting for some Nike corporation created trinket. Huge difference. Ask yourself this,why do those rich kikes call the ghetto folk “Liquid Cash”.
    Now cool down and have some payesham.

    • Replies: @Truth
    , @Truth
  236. Rahan says:
    @Marckus

    Christ, I just saw this.
    Here’s a hug, buddy.

  237. Truth says:
    @Malla

    There is a difference in between fighting for nation or ideology and fighting for some Nike corporation created trinket. Huge difference.

    You’re right again Malls. The latter is fighting to enrich himself instead of an already-rich white guy from Exxon or Mobil.

    • Replies: @Malla
  238. @James O'Meara

    Mann …

    Thomas Mann is a great boring author. His philosophical novels are profound re ideas (some antiquated, but less than expected), but his “characters” are not alive- at least for me. For instance, Naphta & Settembrini are very much alive, but Hans Castorp is a blank slate (and the ending, with “love” is simply – bonkers). Mme. Chauchat is Mann’s idea of feminine mystique, but I’m not convinced. Others are so-so, I just didn’t care for them, dead or alive.

    His Joseph’s novel I did not finish, but he was pulling my leg all the time. Made me think he deliberately plays with a reader to no effect except of boring him to death with his little bag of tricks.

    Doctor Faustus is great in parts, but the whole conception is, in my opinion, radically wrong. This novel on German destiny, or Germanhood, rests on- musicology. And this is indictment of the entire German nation – just in such a bizarre form that even a most extreme literate German nationalist would be left scratching his head on (“What the hell is it all about?”). Mann thought he was deciphering the subtlest lineaments of the archetypal Deutschtum; and, even if such a think exists, in a theosophical sense, Mann was wrong from the get-go. His approach is wrong – the theme is archetypal, not philosophical-essayist-wisdom. Such a novel warrants a prophet, not an (imperfect) sage.

    Lotte in Weimar was better & more readable, but fat old Goethe exposing some mystical Unity of Being to his old flame is, well…strange.

    Musil is perhaps better as an analyst, but he, after all, lacks what the greatest sublime works (Plato, some Upanishads, Shakespeare, Dostoevsky, Whitman, Nietzsche, Proust, …) irradiate- the overabundance of life, beyond the limits of time and tiresome baggage called personality.

  239. @Trinity

    Everybody is repulsed by blacks.

    • Replies: @Trinity
  240. Trinity says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    In PRIVATE, even people like Creepy Joe are, but in PUBLIC he sucks so much Black azz that he chokes on shit. I mean just look how he stammers and stutters trying to read off the teleprompter, he doesn’t even believe that horseshit he tries to peddle. I can not tell you how many cowardly cuckold white traitor trash POS will come up and tell me something in private about Blacks that even makes me cringe, but then they will act totally different in a public setting. I am not talking about dropping the word “nigger” in public or nothing like that, but they will just out and out suck Black azz in front of not only Blacks and other nonwhites but in the presence of nothing but Whites as well, fearful someone will think they are not putting out enough virtue signals. Whites will go and tell nonwhites and especially Blacks that this “white dude is racist,” blah, blah, blah…. lolol. PATHETIC isn’t the word for Whites like that. Blacks and other nonwhites mock them to their face and behind their backs, seen it over and over. And yet these White retards continue to make fools of themselves again and again. Those two face Whites are not fooling anyone, especially the nonwhites that they suck up to out of fear and being afraid of be ostracized as an outsider. lolol at those stupid idiots.

    • Replies: @Truth
  241. Truth says:
    @Trinity

    So, U-T, basically you are saying that everybody who is not black hates blacks because, well, they are terrible.

    And also you are saying that everyone who is not black is a pussy.

    So in a nutshell, everyone on the planet is either a terrible person or a sniveling pussy.

    .. No wonder this world sux so much.

    • Replies: @Trinity
  242. Trinity says:
    @Truth

    NOPE. I am saying that a GREAT DEAL OF WHITES ARE TWO FACE PUSSIES. I can’t speak that much on other races when it comes to this sort of behavior although I have spent a great deal of time with Mexicans and El Salvadorans, as well as Orientals. Orientals are SNEAKY as fuck and are extremely TWO FACED AS WELL, MOST have a very unfavorable opinion of Blacks and hell, most are out for their own, just like every other race but cuckold Whites. Mexicans and Blacks? Mexicans, unlike Whites and Orientals are two faced towards Blacks only when they want to use them, NOT BECAUSE THEY FEAR THEM or because they fear their people will ostracize them. Hell, Mexicans have been running Blacks out of Commiefornia for years. That’s right, White man, that little 5’8″ 150lb Mexican has more balls than you. However, I am starting to see some big Mexicans. Hey Troof, remember when Frazier fought Manuel Ramos? That was a big hombre, he even managed to stagger Frazier before being stopped in 2 rounds. I always got along good with Mexicans for some reason, never any problems, very hard working people and I admire their courage. Hell, Jose, Juan, and Miguel kind of liked ole Trinity as well. GREAT FOOD. But they are better fit for their land, just like the Oriental and Black man. God put us all in different places for a reason. And yes, I will go back to Europe just as soon as the Jews, Arabs, Pakis, East Indians, Africans, and other nonwhites go the hell back home and leave Europe. But lets be fair, it was the White man who built America and everyone knows it. More than happy to give it back to the American Indian just as soon as the Jew gives back Palestine to the Palestinians and all nonwhites leave Europe. You have my word on that one.

  243. Malla says:
    @Truth

    The latter is fighting to enrich himself instead of an already-rich white guy from Exxon or Mobil.

    Wow good answer.
    You are right, the soldier in the uniform does not know he is fighting for Exxon or Mobil. He foolishly believes he is fighting for country or ideology (spread da democracy). It is mostly after retirement that some of them realize the game. However the ghetto brotha “fighting for himself” enriches the White guys running Nike or the Jewish guys who run the basketball teams.

    Again I repeat, the comparison of ghetto behaviour and warfare is stupidity. Please do not waste my time if you continue to keep on making that idiotic comparison.
    The ghetto folks are in a very degraded state of culture and the Satanic elites want us all to become like them. They want us all in the ghetto, hence the spread by rich Jewish corporations and rich music moguls of ghetto culture around the world.

  244. Truth says:

    Yeah, Manuel Ramos had that one great moment. He actually beat Ernie Terrell and Eddie Machen before that, he was a real contender. Frazier pretty much ended him though, he got knocked out about 300 times in a row after that.

    Mexicans, unlike Whites and Orientals are two faced towards Blacks only when they want to use them, NOT BECAUSE THEY FEAR THEM

    Hell, Mexicans have been running Blacks out of Commiefornia for years. That’s right, White man, that little 5’8″ 150lb Mexican has more balls than you.

    Well, that may be a little overrated.

    https://worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshhKHw7GjhX5y25kh8c

    https://worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshhGH6644Nyg5LmFN3h

  245. @Trinity

    Troof gets all his “troofs” from goddamn JewTube.

    Reminds me of that goofy fuker Loup Blanc who is supposedly some retired Law Professor, swallowing the Hidden Figures Hollyweird movie, hook, line and sinker…lol

    Such is the age we live in.

  246. Malla says:
    @Truth

    yo, Truthie, when did you get this new job as Mr.Steve Sailer’s henchman?

    Anyways, I doubt Steve wanted me there, you wanted me there so that you can get some dirt on the fakir who said something about “raw kaffirs”. LOL

  247. @GeeBee

    As a very young man, when I first discovered the D-minor symphony (as I prefer to refer to the ‘ninth’ as), I was shaken to my very core by this (first) movement, and especially by the recapitulation.

    I completely missed this article and the usual great comment thread. Just discovered it yesterday and scrolled through the comments, noting this comment of yours. (I imagine very few readers will even see this comment of mine.)

    I had a similar experience when I first heard the 3rd movement (the adagio) of the 9th. Even 40 years later, I cannot listen to it without experiencing that same depth of emotion, it shuts me down completely.

    This recording of the Chicago symphony, conducted by Muti, has over 27 million views since only 2015:

    I’m not even close to being an expert on music, and would not pretend to know whether this rendition is any better than others, but the camera shots of the musicians and singers seem to indicate that they all understand they are performing something almost singularly unique.

    Cheers!

  248. @notoneofthem

    .. and of course the late Don van Vliet. Although he awarded himself the “van” bit.
    Opinions on the quality of his work are remarkably polarised.

  249. Barzini says:
    @Jerry Roberts

    If those black musicians had been interviewed about the current disparagement of Beethoven, you couldn’t print the responses.

  250. Barzini says:

    It’s not likely that they will succeed in dethroning Beethoven. He is the only musical composer who ever lived who has been consistently popular since he died. No other composer can say this.

  251. Melville says:

    Thus cultural envy goes. The European nations have always had problems with war, disease, famine, etc. But the accomplishments of European cultures, particularly in western Europe, the genius of so many great thinkers, artists, architects, scientists, etc. just absolutely stick in the craw of Cultural Marxists. I find that delightful.

    • Agree: GeneralRipper
  252. Gemjunior says:

    Sounds to me like there’s some green-eyed monsters lurking around the area. I sense just a smattering of butthurt from people feeling inferior to Whitey….

  253. Johan says:

    Romanticism spelled the end of art, ultimately bringing about the subjectivist junk art of late depraved modernity and its primitive celebrity worship culture. Beethoven is no hero of petty modern individualism, and certainly no Nietzschean ‘master of his own fate’. Beethoven would not have liked to be the hero of a bunch of modern out of control democratic rascals, progressive or not.

  254. Anonymous[611] • Disclaimer says:

    I like my blue eyed soul music, and I won’t be deterred.

  255. @raga10

    Offensive tackle Trent Williams has reached a six-year $138.06 million contract with the San Francisco 49ers. This makes Williams the highest-paid offensive lineman in NFL history. Williams signed for 55 million guaranteed money and 30 million signing bonus. Top that Beethoven and all you white dudes —-

    .

  256. @mark green

    Freud said “all homosexuals are mentally ill.” When are they gonna cancel him?
    haha
    BTW the most angry blacks are mixed race. Race is a big, big deal from the minute they are born.
    Look at all the race hustlers half white looking.
    Beethoven didn’t have to perform in his underwear to get noticed like these losers do.

  257. @Truth

    The same (((people))) who promoted (& profited the most from) both World Wars are the same (((people))) who masterminded (& profited the most from) the transatlantic slave trade (the one responsible for you being here instead of your beloved Motherland Africa from which you are secretly happy to have escaped).

    You already know that, don’t you.

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